Car Maintenance Question

[KSMP]

Hi there!

I'm working on a research project for which the topic was assigned. I know nothing about car maintenance. I'm sure all of you are far more knowledgeable on the topic than I am. Could you take my survey here (Car Maintenance Survey) and then post what you thought of the survey? Should I add any questions? Did it make sense? I'd really appreciate it.

Thank you!
KSMP

[Epistemology]

I took your survey. Here is what I think.

The part where you ask for only three words to describe two different manufacturers is poorly conceived. Three words isn't enough to describe what I think of Fram, for example. Fram makes both premium filters with decent (I buy Mobil 1, though) drain back valves and they make BS with low surface area and a crappy valve. No one wants to respond to a survey under that limit.

You focus a lot on brand perception in your survey. However, you need to include more technical reasons for selecting a certain oil filter or oil. Read about filtration surface area, synthetic versus cellulose filter material, drain back valve, et cetera.

Also, there's a lot more than that to car maintenance. If you just change your oil every 3000 miles and never do anything else, depending on the vehicle, you're going to do a lot of damage. Antifreeze needs changing for protection from block damage in freezing conditions, rear ends need their fluid checked, etc.

Another way to keep your car working is to keep it away from oil change places and mechanics. These places often do really hack jobs on cars, or gouge the customer.

Hope this helps.

[Epistemology]

A few more thoughts...

For those of us who like buying used cars or own vehicles with >10,000 miles, maintenance becomes much more involved. Checking wheel bearings, checking/replacing the timing chain/tensioner, water pump, thermostat, ignition system components, etc.

Probably the biggest thing about keeping a vehicle running properly is having real oil pressure and temp. guages that you check and checking the fluids frequently.

[Moppie]

Originally Posted by Epistemology

Probably the biggest thing about keeping a vehicle running properly is having real oil pressure and temp. guages that you check and checking the fluids frequently.

You've never owned a Japanese car have you?

[MagicRat]

I have some background in market research and that survey was a good one. One can compile some meaningful and relevant stats from it.

IMHO it hit on all the basic buyer motivations for a filter choice.

[Epistemology]

MagicRat: I disagree. Some buyers may be motivated by the things he hit upon like availability, brand perception, etc. However, the survey totally ignores those of us who read about filters and tear apart filters to see how well they are made (drain back valve, amount of filter material, etc.). Are people really stupid enough to only go by some perceived notion of quality just because that brand has good marketing?

Moppie: After WWII, the U.S. et al put into Japan's constitution that they could not expend more than 1% of their GDP on military. While I agree that Japan has made some very good products, including some really good cars, Japanese cars are NOT exempt from the same failure modes as Korean, European, or American cars. There have actually been quite a few Japanese engines that are prone to pretty severe issues.

[Epistemology]

MagicRat: I disagree. Some buyers may be motivated by the things he hit upon like availability, brand perception, etc. However, the survey totally ignores those of us who read about filters and tear apart filters to see how well they are made (drain back valve, amount of filter material, etc.). Are people really stupid enough to only go by some perceived notion of quality just because that brand has good marketing?

Moppie: After WWII, the U.S. et al put into Japan's constitution that they could not expend more than 1% of their GDP on military. This forced Japan to invest heavily in building a strong market ecoomy. While I agree that Japan has made some very good products, including some really good cars, Japanese cars are NOT exempt from the same failure modes as Korean, European, or American cars. There have actually been quite a few Japanese engines that are prone to pretty severe issues.

[Epistemology]

Stupid ethernet cable fell out. Argh.

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by Epistemology

MagicRat: I disagree. Some buyers may be motivated by the things he hit upon like availability, brand perception, etc. However, the survey totally ignores those of us who read about filters and tear apart filters to see how well they are made (drain back valve, amount of filter material, etc.).

My business degree major was marketing..........
A good survey must be reasonably succinct, brief and manageable.
A survey often cannot hit every possible motivation, just the major ones, or else it risks being huge, unwieldy and fatigues the people who answer it.

Even for do-it-yourselfers, very few people actually cut filters open....... and when they do it is more to detect problems with a particular engine rather than to evaluate filter performance. So I can see that a survey may have to ignore such a small number of purchase motivations. However, a 'comment' box could be included at the end of a survey to ask about such unusual purchase motivations.

Originally Posted by Epistemology

Are people really stupid enough to only go by some perceived notion of quality just because that brand has good marketing?.

Yes, often they are.......
These days it is difficult to successfully sell a product based purely on excellent performance with an absence of marketing.

I should also add that 'marketing' is not just advertising and promotion. It also includes efforts to design, build and provide goods and services that people actually want..............
For example, good marketing means that if people really WANT to open their oil filters after use, then a filter should be made with a screw cap, so it can easily be unscrewed and opened for inspection.

Hey, thats a GREAT idea.......... where is the patent office...........

[Moppie]

Originally Posted by MagicRat

Hey, thats a GREAT idea.......... where is the patent office...........

Most British cars from the 60s and 70s used a cartridge type filter that sat inside a seperate housing.

You simply replaced the cartridge, meaning you could inspect the filter element everytime you removed it.
In my old Triumph the housing was held on by a wingnut, so you could inspect it at anytime very easily.

[Moppie]

Originally Posted by Epistemology

Japanese cars are NOT exempt from the same failure modes as Korean, European, or American cars. There have actually been quite a few Japanese engines that are prone to pretty severe issues.

However the failures are the exception, rather than the rule.
Which is why the Japanese car industry is still doing reasonably well (all things considered) and Ford and GM etc are not.

I have a 20 year old Japanese car, that still goes very well.
The only thing wrong with it, not related to some cheap panel work, is the speedo playing up.

And it is not a unique car. 75% of the NZ's vehicle fleet is made up of used Japanese imports, with an average age of about 15 years.

[Epistemology]

Moppie: And I have a 20 year old car that still works well. However, these examples are anecdotal. An example of a bad Japanese design would be the three liter Mitsubishi motor. They get awfully noisy, they burn oil early in life, headgaskets tend to go, and they like to throw rods.

I will agree that right now, Japan is making better cars than America and has been more responsive to the consumer (better marketing). The SUV is a horrible consumer passenger vehicle and has killed the work Lee Iaccoca did to put good American-made cars on the road.

[LeSabre97mint]

Originally Posted by Moppie

Most British cars from the 60s and 70s used a cartridge type filter that sat inside a seperate housing.

You simply replaced the cartridge, meaning you could inspect the filter element everytime you removed it.
In my old Triumph the housing was held on by a wingnut, so you could inspect it at anytime very easily.

My 58 Plymouth has a cartridge filter. FYI

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by Moppie

Most British cars from the 60s and 70s used a cartridge type filter that sat inside a seperate housing.

You simply replaced the cartridge, meaning you could inspect the filter element everytime you removed it.
In my old Triumph the housing was held on by a wingnut, so you could inspect it at anytime very easily.

I have had a number of vehicles with cartridge type filters as they were common in American cars up to the '60's.
Even now my farm tractors and street bikes still have them.

I like the cartridge system, although they may not be so neat and clean, they were in some ways easier to service than a modern type. They do not get stuck on, crumple or rupture