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Old 06-26-2005, 04:10 PM   #1
kitch
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1998 Windstar rough idle

I have a 1998 windstar GL with 180000 km on it. I have had no trouble with it to now and by the sounds of it I am lucky. I am getting codes of P0171 system adaptive fuel too lean bank #1, P1131 lack of HO2S switches-sensors indicate lean, P0133 upstream heated O2 sensor circuit slow response bank #1, P0306 cylinder #6 misfire detected. I have tested EGR valve, DPFE, TPS,MAF,VSS,IAV, these tested fine to the haynes book. I have also changed fuel filter, upper intake gaskets, upstream O2 sensor bank #1, plugs, plug wires, coil pack, pcv and hose for pcv. I have brought it to two garages and they both say the head gasket. I did my own compression test and all the front cylinders read 115 to 125psi. I get good compression on the front side but #6 cylinder misfires. At idle I can pull off #6 and #5 plug wire with no real reaction from the engine (one at a time) when I pull #4 plug wire off, the engine drops idle to almost a stall. The garages did not do a leak down test so how do they know it is the head gasket. This all stared when at a stop the engine would rev up to 1200 rpm then slow down to idle and it has got to when turning a corner it stalls. Please help I am running out of options.
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Old 06-26-2005, 11:28 PM   #2
CoachKarl
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

Welcome Kitch.

Boy you're thorough. Nice work. Electricity seems fine, then, go onto the tubes. Check for leaks. My guess, considering all you have done, is going to be way simple. Start with the fuel line hoses that feed the dfpe. I've found mine full of white powder. Remove, inspect and replace if necessary, all the vaccum tubes.

Karl.

You have plugged your codes into the "Search this forum" box, right?
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Old 06-27-2005, 05:40 PM   #3
kitch
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Re: Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

Yes I have plugged my codes in but none come up with #6 misfire (po3o6). I know if you have a misfire code on #1 and/or #4 your egr ports need to be cleaned. This is why I am stumped. I have cleaned the egr ports changed the upper intake gaskets to the new style. I am trying everything before I strip it down to the head gaskets. Thank you for the reply.
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Old 06-27-2005, 06:06 PM   #4
floridatgp
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

bad fuel injector? swop injector with other cylinders
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Old 06-27-2005, 06:50 PM   #5
kitch
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

Tried that moved #6 to #4 still missfire on #6. I am going to check the fuel pressure regulator. I was wondering if there is anyway to check it so there is a noticable change to engine rpm's. Either by increasing or decreasing the pressure in the regulator.
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Old 06-27-2005, 07:03 PM   #6
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

Perhaps the module that drives the injectors is bad, need some way to determine if cylinder #6 injector is getting pulsed correctly. I remember my son's vortec v6, all injectors fired at same time, I guess timing of inejector spray is not to critical, maybe cross wire with another injector? You have good compression, good spark, all that's left is fuel.
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Old 06-27-2005, 08:11 PM   #7
kitch
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

I did not think of that to cross the injector cables put #4 with #6 if all injectors fire at same time. I will hav eto try that.
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Old 06-27-2005, 08:34 PM   #8
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

The injectors are energized by the PCM......
When the key is ON.....1 of the 2 wires to each injector is HOT all the time. The PCM provides a momentary path to ground to energize the coil in the injector to provide the squirt of fuel.
If you know that the injector is good (and clean)......the most likely problem would be in the wiring to the injector. Even the plug connection at the injector. The PCM is not likely at fault.

Have you been needing to add coolant?

Also, was there a green stain on the Oxygen sensor when you changed it?.....this would be an indication of a coolant leak into the cylinder.
For your year.....a leak in the lower intake manifold gasket is more likely than a head gasket.
For a slight leak....Bar's Stop Leak should take care of it.

I would recommend changing oxygen sensors in PAIRS with Motorcraft brand ONLY. You can get Motorcraft brand for a reasonable price at www.rockauto.com
The code indicating a slow response for an oxygen sensor is most likely a bad oxygen sensor.
By pairs...I mean....both upstream sensors together....so that you have the same switching charactoristics. It is normal for oxygen sensors to switch slower as they get older. Changing 1 with a new sensor.....would most likely have banks #1 and 2 not switching at the same rate.
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Old 06-27-2005, 08:43 PM   #9
kitch
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

No I am not loosing coolant.
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Old 06-27-2005, 08:48 PM   #10
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

I am wondering after reading the forums that did the 1998 windstar bank 1 valve cover need to be replaced. If so how can you tell if it has been changed. It looks as if I have oil leaking on the fire wall side of engine down to tranny. Not lots but enough. At first I thought it was the tranny fluid but it is oil. Notice when I was changing the oxygen sensor.
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Old 06-28-2005, 09:59 PM   #11
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

I called my dealer ship and found out that it is the bank #2 valve cover. Sorry front of engine (grill) this is prone to missfire in the front with lean in the back. This causes more fuel to be dumped into the front to counter act the lean the the back cause flood conditions in the front. If anyone understands that.
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Old 06-29-2005, 03:50 PM   #12
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if you have a cylinder 6 misfire, it can still be the EGR ports. If you pull the upper intake, you'll have ports to each cylinder for the egr, they are about the size of a dime with a small hole in the center. If they are all clogged except 6, you'll get excessive flow and a miss, especially at cold start up.

PS the way you check to see if you have the updated bank 2 valve cover is pull off the PCV hose on the left of the valve cover (left as you are facing the front of the car and the valve cover) and look inside. The updated ones have a small breather hole. No hole, no update.
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Old 07-01-2005, 11:46 AM   #13
kitch
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

I have cleaned the egr ports. The cel has gone out after about 2 days of driving after I have changed the O2 sensor. I still have spark knock I see there is a tsb for 99 and 00. Is there one for 98. I think I found something yesterday. I borrowed a vacuum leak tester and it pointed me in the general vicinity long story short it is either the evr or the vacuum lines to the evr or the electical conection. evr $132 cdn. vacuum lines $23 and $19. So far I have spentabout $1600 water pump, timeing gasket and labourer was about $1100.
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Old 07-01-2005, 09:51 PM   #14
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Re: 1998 Windstar rough idle

The TSB for the valve cover and upper intake manifold bolts / gaskets is for '99 and newer. They started using a different intake manifold in '99 that was causing problems. This TSB does NOT apply to your '98.

Cleaning EGR ports is standard....normal service at the age / miles.

Vaccum leaks are an issue on almost any car.....and can be hard to track down.

Check the elbow that is on the top of the upper intake manifold......next to the throttle body. The Elbow points toward the firewall.....and goes to the PCV valve. They can develop a crack on the inside of the elbow.

Also, check to make sure that the dip stick is fully seated. The air that flows into the front valve cover to replace the air that the PCV takes out....is measured.....flows through the MAF with the rest of the air. So....if the dip stick is not seated fully.....air can leak in......which the computer does not know about.

Make sure that the red vaccum line that connects to the fuel pressure regulator is correctly seated. The fuel pressure regulator is mounted to the crome fuel rail.....on the passenger side. The red vaccum line connects to the top of it.

Double check to make sure that no vaccum lines have been bumped loose... There are a bunch of them on the back side of the upper intake manifold......back where you cannot see them....so you have to feel around back there.

I have a number of pictures of my '96 3.8L....that may help you find things....as your '98 will be very similar. http://community.webshots.com/album/201931518cScpNK
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Old 07-01-2005, 10:23 PM   #15
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For the misfire, I'd suspect your coil pack. I was getting a consistant misfire on #4 and changed coil pack, plugs, wires, & injector and that fixed it. I believe it was the coil pack that was the problem, not the others.

For the p0107 code I'd say a vacuum leak. Did you try to spray carb cleaner around the intake and hoses listening for a stuble?
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