Motor Trend Ford GT versus Viper revisited

[syr74]

Okay, if you don't already have a copy go grab the latest Motor Trend off the rack. Go to the letters section and amidst a sea of "The Viper is so awesome since it is as fast as the new GT for half the price" letters you will find what was IMHO the most interesting letter of them all.

It seems that prior to the GT versus Viper comparo Motor Trend tested the new Viper's acceleration and handling limits three times. Two of those tests the Viper turned in low 12 second performances through the 1/4-mile, and one time it actually went significantly quicker turning a 1/4-mile e.t. in the 11's.

The letter to Motor tend I already mentioned points out that not only were the Viper's 1/4 mile acceleration numbers also in the 11's in that latest comparo against the Ford GT just as in that one earlier test, it was exactly the same e.t.. For that matter it was exactly the same mph through the traps as well. And, it is of note that every cited acceleration and handling figure was identical to what had been wrought in that earlier test.

It gets better when in MT's response they fess up to being guilty of a bit of handi-capping. Indeed those were not the numbers that the test Viper turned on that track, that day versus the Ford GT. The numbers were indeed "borrowed" from the previous test where the Viper turned it's best times. However, Motor trend did give the comforting comment that "we are confident that the Viper tested could have produced similar numbers under the test day conditions."

Really, it could have? Then PRINT THOSE NUMBERS and settle it for us fellas. Obviously Motor Trend got numbers from the Viper on that day as they got them from the Ford GT. And, Motor trend indeed did use the Viper's braking numbers from that day as they were "best ever" numbers. Of course, it apparently did not bother Motor Trend to test the Ford GT's braking on a different, and admittedly slippier, portion of tarmac than the Viper! Hey fellas. why not tie a cargo container to the GT's roof during any future top speed testing as well? Perhaps some ballast during future acceleration runs?

If the acceleration and handling numbers from that day were the same or very similar why aren't they in the article instead? Motor trend also implied that the "borrowed" acceleration and handling numbers published in the Viper/GT article were indeed the best they have ever gotten from a Viper to date. Hmmmmm. wouldn't that mean that the Viper DID NOT equal those numbers on the day of testing versus the Ford GT if those were still, indeed, the best numbers? What a load of bullshit.

Could it be that on that day, on that track, under those conditions the Viper took a good old Ford GT-delivered ass-whoopin', and that didn't make for as good a comparison? I would bet that is at least one very sound theory. At least it sounds that way to me considering they had to "borrow" numbers from another test. Who is to say that if the Ford GT had run in the earlier test where the Viper actually ran an 11 second 1/4-mile the Ford wouldn't have run a low eleven instead of a mid to high eleven it ran on the day of testing?

I suppose we can kiss integrity in journalism goodbye at Motor Trend. And, I suppose we will have to rethink the Viper's nearly equal performance numbers as compared to the ford GT. My fearless prediction. When Road and Track gets their hands on a GT again and runs it against the Viper the GT blows the Vipers ass off. As it likely already did just that in it's "handicapped" Motor Trend match-up.

[Neutrino]

Bleh...who knows what else goes behind the scenes during those comparisons. Some people even claim that manufactures can offer certain "incetives" to have one car come on top. Soemetimes manufacturers deliver "hot" cars.

And there is always the amateur factor. So cars are just easier to drive fast than others for amateurs. So one car might be just faster because its more forgiving.

Point is argumets can be made for both sides and we need to take most of those articles with a grain of salt.


I just wish they would have some true stock car racing like back in the days. Then we would really see who is better.

[crayzayjay]

Originally Posted by Neutrino

Bleh...who knows what else goes behind the scenes during those comparisons. Some people even claim that manufactures can offer certain "incetives" to have one car come on top. Soemetimes manufacturers deliver "hot" cars.

And there is always the amateur factor. So cars are just easier to drive fast than others for amateurs. So one car might be just faster because its more forgiving.

All true.

I trust certain magazines and certain companies more than others.

[Kurtdg19]

I'm going to have to agree with syr74 with the credibility of motortrend. After reading that article, I lost even more respect in their opinion. Think of all the potential readers that could be mis lead due to the incompetence of an 'oh-so-favorable' journalist mag. More like toilet paper... Why aren't they showing same day results? Why are they testing the same test on different and unequal areas of track? Are they trying to hide somthing? Are they being overly biased to the Viper? These type of questions popped in my head after reading it. This just shows that you can't take their word for granted. I'll wait for a more reliable comparsion before I make any final decision.

[YogsVR4]

Perhaps a couple test drives will give me the feel for which one is faster.













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[Neutrino]

Originally Posted by YogsVR4

Perhaps a couple test drives will give me the feel for which one is faster.

Hmmm....let see:

YogsSRT10
YogsGT

[Polygon]

I have never fully trusted Motor Trend. I have always felt them to be biased and, at times, unprofessional. However, I doubt that the difference in the numbers produced by the Viper on the day of testing and the ones actually used were very far off at all. Don't even compare that to adding drag or weight to the GT as a handicap for the Viper. Those are the numbers they have found the Viper to be capable of so a Viper can be nearly as fast as a GT for about half the price. I don't see why you're getting in such a tiff over something so trivial. Anyhow, as Neutrino said, you've got to take these articles with a grain of salt.

[syr74]

Well, considering that the only two other quarter mile times Motor Trend has ever "officially" published from a Viper were both 12.3's I would have to say that the lone 11 second run is not a good indication of what they have found the Viper to be capable of.

Yes, a 12.3 is slow for a Viper IMO. However, considering that this is the "average" time Motor Trend drivers seem to get from the snake perhaps the GT is capable of far better than what they saw on test day as well. Perhaps the same driver who couldn't get any better than a 12.3 from the Viper tested the GT on that day. And, for all we know on the day of the comparison test the Viper may have run another 12.3, and not anywhere near the elevens.

Whatever it ran on that day we know that it was not as fast as the numbers published in the comparison, and this is according to Motor Trend. And, we also know that it did not handle as well as the numbers used in the article on that particular day either. The gap in performance during that test was larger than Motor Trend's numbers implied, the only question was big it truly was.

This s called comparo is totally useless even when compared to the average magazione comparo. THe numbers are contrived and in the Viper's case hand picked. I stand by my assertion that the first time the Viper meets the GT in a real comparo, preferably with a credible race car driver behind the wheel, the GT will likely blow the Vipers ass off.

[Mr Payne]

This is a comparison I want:

360 CS
996 GT2
996 GT3
Gallardo
GT
Viper
Z06 (just to serve as a baseline and see what all the extra money actually means to lap times)

Only then will we know how the top dog is.

[syr74]

Originally Posted by Mr Payne

This is a comparison I want:

360 CS
996 GT2
996 GT3
Gallardo
GT
Viper
Z06 (just to serve as a baseline and see what all the extra money actually means to lap times)

Only then will we know how the top dog is.

I second the above. Let the games begin.

[moslerporschefreak]

And let the stig drive them. The only comparos that I really trust are thos by good old TG. Also add to that list the Ascari KZ1. It isn't as popular, or as well known, but it fits the bill in terms of price and performance. Also, these aren't necessarily in the same price range, but for kicks and giggles, lets throw in the elise and M12 GTO as well.