94 Cutlass Ciera S--Fuel pump problem?

[Ardan]

Hello, again! For the moderator from the last posting I made: Yes, it was what your suggestion was. The struts were fine, too. Sorry that I didn't follow up on that one! Okay, I have a big problem and i'm going to spill it out. I have NO experience at all in what someone suspects it involves, so i'm going to give all the recent details and hope someone has any suggestions.

1994 Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera S with approx. 129,000 miles
3.1L V6 VIN M engine
--New spark plugs and plug wires last year (Double platinum plugs with good wires that seem thicker than the original ones)
--Replaced two of the ignition coils last year as well
--recently replaced the MAF sensor as well as installed a new air filter (K&N).
--Oxygen sensor was replaced once, but its been a while and I don't know when it was (the person that replaced it surely knows though, and I could ask)

Of note is that there was a coolant leak, and a nearby Goodyear repair shop repaired that and an observed leak (after a pressure test) of the intake manifold seal.

The engine, for quite a while now, has ran unbelievably well and *was* getting good gas mileage. It always cranked over really fast, even in this bitterly cold minnesota winter.

My problem is that it won't start. The engine cranks over very fast, consistently fast but it doesn't complete the process. Just cranks, and cranks, and cranks. Aside from Chilton's, I use alldatadiy.com to get all the details for the car. A family member (whom is very experienced) noted that the car appeared to not get any gas at all, so we suspected the fuel filter.

When replacing the filter, far less fuel than expected had drained into a pan. He took some voltage tests and determined that the fuel pump appears to be getting power to it. We are not very experienced at all when it comes to in-tank electric fuel pumps, so we are skeptical. What also makes us wonder is that twice it has started, but then killed after 2 or 3 seconds of running. Tonight, we took a page from alldatadiy.com and someone tried to crank the engine over while we listened for the pump. We could hear the pump operating when the car nearly started, but it immediately stopped working and the car never started. We are hesitant to do the chore of replacing that pump without doing some tests first.

Of note is that it would periodically stall/die while sitting at stoplights over the last, oh, 6 to 9 months and it was never consistent until the last few weeks. Aside from seeming to use way more gas than it should be using, the car was surging when i'd sit and place it in park. I hope I chose the right term for that! I'd turn the car on or i'd come home from work and when i'd sit in the drive way (or in a parking lot), you could hear it really surge loudly. A sister of mine even commented that I shouldn't be revving the engine late at night until she saw me standing outside the car asking for her to hear this noise. Often times, there was a really foul smell in the car after the surge passes.

I have no tach, so I don't know what the rpm was going up to, but it would go up and down, up and down, and the lights would dim accordingly as well. If it was night time and you had the headlights on, the lights would dim when the point of the surging was the low point. Sometimes it went away, and sometimes the car stopped running. When decelerating to a left turn light a few weeks ago, it even stalled/stopped running while I was just coasting to the light. The last thing of note is that if you have to go WOT or nearly WOT, sometimes it would jump and just launch you into next week, and other times it would think about it first. I would characterize it as that I was taking it easy on the throttle, but then punched it down...only the throttle was punched down the entire time. The first thing established by a family member while I was working was that it is getting spark, and he says that it is definitely not an ignition coil problem (I was just merely wondering if we replaced all three, and he said that).

Do any of you fine people have any suggestions? He said it doesn't seem to be getting any fuel pressure, but he's hesitant to say the fuel pump failed because the car does actually start some times. Some have said maybe the fuel pressure regulator, others the throttle position sensor, and some say "a car has that?" :P. Sorry for the long post, if anyone was interested. Its just that I am now reading up on everything, since that is the one area I haven't touched. Since I don't entirely know what could be causing it, I felt that I should mention EVERYTHING I recall recently.

When we get this solved, I will surely follow up this time with an explanation . Unless someone knows and can explain to me why they say that it is for sure the fuel pump and that I should replace that as soon as we have time to drain the tank and remove it. I would hate to do all that and then find out that it is something else.

[GTP Dad]

Your fuel pump needs to be replaced! The cause of low fuel pressure is due to two things. Bad fuel pressure regulator or bad fuel pump. Since you stated that the amount of fuel coming from the fuel filter is low then the fuel pump is probably bad. A quick check is to spray some starting fluid into the throttle body as someone cranks the car. If it starts then the fuel system is the issue and in your case the fuel pump is the culprit.

[Ardan]

Originally Posted by GTP Dad

Your fuel pump needs to be replaced! The cause of low fuel pressure is due to two things. Bad fuel pressure regulator or bad fuel pump. Since you stated that the amount of fuel coming from the fuel filter is low then the fuel pump is probably bad. A quick check is to spray some starting fluid into the throttle body as someone cranks the car. If it starts then the fuel system is the issue and in your case the fuel pump is the culprit.

Thanks, the help is appreciated! I sprayed some starting fluid into it as you suggested while another cranked the car and the car did start. It makes sense, and i'm going to go and buy a fuel pump and strainer right after posting this message. One of our vehicles is a station wagon from '89 (boy that Chevrolet looks nice *still*) and it is getting low on gas. Perfect timing since I have to drain the fuel tank!

We have re-sealed an intake manifold on that wagon before (or was it exhaust? I can't remember) and we have disassembled and reassembled a car's engine after it siezed up (and we did get it running again). I hear from those that have done it that if we can do those, then replacing a fuel pump should be "a walk in the park." I hope thats true, because I don't have much time to do this!

Have a good day.