NY State near Canadian border -- 75 in 65 -- need advise on process

[cannondale0815]

Last Friday I was on my way from my home in New Jersey to Ottawa. One mile from the Canadian border, right before the Thousand Island bridge, I was pulled over by a state trooper. He first told me that I didn't signal for a lane change. I contested that and told him that I did indicate for a lane change, and that I always do it, as it is just as second nature as buckling up. He then said that he would then have to give me a speeding ticket instead. I was asking him on what grounds, and he claimed that I was driving for several miles behind him at a constant distance, and that he himself was driving at 75, therefore he knew that I also was driving 75. I was baffled. When I later reviewed the ticket he gave me, it further claimed that he used a Stalker Dual radar gun to verify my speed. This is not true, as I have a radar detector in my car (which is legal in NY State), and it remained silent throughout the ordeal, so I know that he didn't point a radar gun at me. I also know, as a fact, that I never even breached 70mph. I later reviewed the trip information in my GPS (a Garmin StreetPilot C550), and it confirmed to me that my max speed for the entire trip never exceeded 70mph.

On my way back from Ottawa to NJ I dropped by the court in Lafargeville, NY, to contest the ticket. The judge was very friendly and told me that I have two options for a non-guilty plea. One is to go to court, and the other one is to send a friendly letter to the local DA and ask him to reduce the ticket. I opted for the latter and am about to draft my letter, but have a few questions:

1) Should I tell the DA about my frustration with the state police officer?

2) Should I tell the DA that I was using a radar detector as proof that the officer never used a radar gun on me?

3) Or should I just be very polite in the letter, not mentioning any negatives against the cop, and just ask for a reduction of the points / fine?

I want to add that I have had my NJ drivers license for the past four years (before that I only had a German drivers license), and during this time, I have never gotten a speeding ticket (in fact I never got pulled over before), and I never committed any other kind of traffic violation, no red lights, no parking tickets, nothing.

Any help as to how to proceed in this matter is greatly appreciated!

-J

[fredjacksonsan]

Wow..yeah a lying cop that's out to get you for something is a tough one, since the judge usually takes their side.

That said, if you can print out your GPS statistics then I'd include them with your letter. That will show that you didn't exceed 70.

Also, I would be inclined to tell the entire story you wrote above, but clean it up so it doesn't sound like you're accusing the officer. Admit to confusion over why you got the ticket, and tell the DA you were using cruise control set at some legal speed.

It's going to come down to what he believes and if he'll drop the charges....which unfortunately right now may be decided by how much money the State of NY needs.

I would ask first that he drop the charges. If he refuses, a second letter asking for a reduction would be in order.

Good luck and let us know how it comes out.

edit: Also, hopefully a 2nd/3rd opinion will come in shortly.

[SUPERDAVE22]

So does that mean he was speeding and it is ok for the people who are suppose to uphold the law to also break the same law he was giving you a ticket for? I think the gps printout should be sufficient enoughr depending on how often it updates itself. And i probably would mention the radar detector if legal, but remember that most who have a radar dectector usually break the speed limit(reason for owning). Nothing burns me more than to be driving down the road and have a police officer blow right past me speeding. Good luck

['97ventureowner]

Originally Posted by fredjacksonsan

It's going to come down to what he believes and if he'll drop the charges....which unfortunately right now may be decided by how much money the State of NY needs.

I would ask first that he drop the charges. If he refuses, a second letter asking for a reduction would be in order.

Basically I agree with fredjacksonsan. I would try the same thing. And as a resident of NY I can tell you firsthand the State is hurting bad for revenue. They have recently increased the surcharges tacked onto the fines as away to increase revenue. They will more than likely reduce the charges and not throw out the ticket completely so they can at least charge you a surcharge.

Originally Posted by SUPERDAVE22

So does that mean he was speeding and it is ok for the people who are suppose to uphold the law to also break the same law he was giving you a ticket for?

Pretty much that is the way it is in NY . They write the laws like the ban on cell phone and texting while driving, yet they exempt the police from them .The excuse given is that the emergency personnel may be on the phone with confidential conversations or other emergency communications. Yeah right. If that's the case then there must be an awful lot of emergency communications going on all the time as that is all you see, the police driving while on a cell phone. You also see the police flip on their lights and hit the siren to go through a red light only to turn them off and resume normal speed a short distance down the road.

[cannondale0815]

Many thanks for everyone's help. It's a shame that it might all come down to how greedy NY state is, not whether I actually did something wrong or not.

I played with my GPS for a while, but am unable to download the trip information to my PC. All I can do is take a photo of the trip information screen, which has information about the average speed and also the max speed since the last reset. Not sure though that this would hold up, as it does not have any location information on it.

Dave, regarding my radar detector, I share your opinion that it might backfire if I disclose that I was using one (even though it's legal in NY and NJ). But mentioning this fact is the only way I can add substance to my argument that the cop did not in fact use a radar gun on me. I wonder which might be more beneficial to me.

Fred, thanks for your advise on the cruise control. I did in fact use cruise control, and I usually set the needle between 65 and 70 in a 65 zone. If I were to explain it like that to the DA, would that actually also mean that I would be admitting to a little bit of speeding?

So I am tempted to write a friendly letter to the DA now, but also clearly state that I am confused about several things:

1) Why did the trooper change his story after pulling me over? First he tried to pin a lane change signal error on me, then he cited me for speeding?
EDIT: It's all becoming clear to me now, the more I think about it: Forgetting to signal for a lane change is a lesser charge, and would have allowed the officer (and NY state) to still charge me money, but probably without resulting in points to me. But when I pushed back hard on this, I agitated him even more, and he then pulled the 'ace' of a speeding ticket out of his sleeve. Could this have been the case?

2) Why did the trooper tell me that he measured my speed based on his own speed, and later on add to the ticket that he was supposedly using a radar gun?

3) Why did the trooper wait until I almost reached the toll booths for the Thousand Island bridge (1 mile from Canadian border) before pulling me over, if in fact my speeding violation occurred several miles beforehand -- in the 65 zone, not in the 55 zone that I was in when he finally stopped me.

4) My radar detector was not triggered, therefore I know the cop didn't use a radar gun on me

5) My GPS trip information screen later proofed to me that I never exceeded 70 mph during the entire trip from Jersey City to Ottawa.

6) I was using cruise control during the entire trip. In the 65 mph zone leading up to the Thousand Island bridge, my speed was set to between 65 and 70, and definitely below 70.

Do you guys concur that the six points above are ok to be put in the DA letter? I will add to the letter that I am asking for this charge to be dismissed, as I have personal proof that I did not do anything wrong. I call it "personal proof", as the facts I mentioned above cannot be easily proven in a court of law, but they were sufficient to personally convince me that I was treated unjust.

Oh, one other thing: The officer employed some intimidation tactics on me. He was agitated from the beginning and his voice was almost at screaming levels several times during the ordeal. I guess that is something I should rather not mention, right?

Thanks!
-J

P.S.: I got laid off in February this year and am currently receiving unemployment benefits from NY State (even though I live in NJ, I have always worked in NY). Does anyone have any opinion on whether this could help (or hurt) me if I were to mention this fact to the DA?

[fredjacksonsan]

If you use the cruise control angle, I'd say to try to get a reduction to a lesser speeding charge.

The fact that you're on unemployment isn't covered by the law, either you were speeding or not. But it might gain some sympathy depending on who you talk to, but I wouldn't count on it.

You could certainly use the 6 points outlined above, but as always there's no guarantee. Take a look at the point structure of the state, make an anonymous call to your insurance company to check on any possible increase, and make your decision on which way to go.

It might pay to plead guilty to a lesser charge (like speeding 5 over), just pay the fine and have no points or insurance increase. Since they're being greedy with fines and this was definitely a REP (revenue enhancement patrol) traffic stop, this might be the best way to handle it.