Forget "Joe", listen to Barack

This bears repeating. All you Obamabots do what you want. :sly:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rYgKFWHzE0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptn3DC3EYRc&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0X0iBH7EEMs&feature=related

I have a pretty good idea how his administration is going to treat me for being "successful". Maybe that should read "gainfully employed".

I'm far from a repub shill, but anybody with a brain can see where ole BO is going with "spread the wealth around."

Time to pay attention to the message and stop flitting all over the place :runaround: asking if "Joe" is real or not. Obama said what he said. Period.

Here's another good link for sound bites.

http://www.hypemovie.com/?gclid=CKSsnPbPs5YCFQhMGgodVC1gLQ

What's the problem here again? Somebody who makes a lot of money worried that they'll potentially have to pay a lot of taxes?

What's the problem here again? Somebody who makes a lot of money worried that they'll potentially have to pay a lot of taxes?

I think the concern has not to do with the payment of the taxes by the high income group - it's to do with the intent to then redistribute the money to the low income group.

I think people miss where social security checks already come from.

Exactly. Another concern would be whose definition of "high income" we would use as a guideline.

Entitlement runs deep in some circles; the radical (and the not so radical) left would suggest that anyone making a comfortable living from their own efforts should not be allowed to do so without giving some of it to one who doesn't have as much. Enforced charitable giving, as it were.

Hey, it made Marx popular with the masses ..................

I suppose really it depends on how they plan to use the money, but I get the feeling that the government won't keep the "rich people money" separate from everybody else's taxes, and then use it exclusively to spend on things that benefit the poor.

Really if they want to spend money that way, they could just trim some money out of the bloated military budget, instead of making higher taxes. (although since this logical conclusion simultaneously runs counter to both republican and democratic practices it would likely never happen.)

I suppose really it depends on how they plan to use the money, but I get the feeling that the government won't keep the "rich people money" separate from everybody else's taxes, and then use it exclusively to spend on things that benefit the poor.


Of course not, but it sounds much more noble than saying, "we're just going to tax the hell out of everybody with an income to pay for our inefficiencies and faulty social programs."

I have no problem with the government jacking up taxes for high income folks...nobody "deserves" to be making $500,000 a year while others are struggling to survive. And to hear people saying that their "hard earned money goes to pay for slugs to sit on their asses" is a disgusting, ignorant, and downright idiotic thing to say. It proves only that such people lack a basic understanding of how socioeconomic forces work.

I think people miss where social security checks already come from.

The social security tax pays for those checks. Up to the first $102,000 which includes most of us the tax is 12.4%. If you make a million a year your tax is 1.2%. if you make two million your tax is .6%

The social security tax pays for those checks. Up to the first $102,000 which includes most of us the tax is 12.4%. If you make a million a year your tax is 1.2%. if you make two million your tax is .6%

So you're not denying it's a tax? :lol:

Of course not, but it sounds much more noble than saying, "we're just going to tax the hell out of everybody with an income to pay for our inefficiencies and faulty social programs."

Like the totally flawed war on drugs, or putting people in prison for longer terms (oh and mandatory sentencing in conjunction with this) with an emphasis on boring them instead of reforming them...

So you're not denying it's a tax? :lol:
of course not, I'm very aware of this tax since most peeps who work for the man only see half of it deducted from their pay and the man matches it, however I work for my self and pay the full tax in addition to my IRA's and other investments.

How much have you saved up for retirment, or are you just waiting for your social security check?

Don't slant this to make me sound evil, but why? Why shouldn't people be allowed to make $500,000 a year. Yeah, it sucks there are people out there struggling to survive but I don't believe it the government's responsibility to redistribute. What about someone who has done nothing short of busting their ass from day 1 to do well in life? They should be required by law to distribute more of their money to people who make less? I believe it is a moral obligation to give to those less fortunate but do not see any reason to be forced to distribute more of your income. My family has done well in life by working 12-15 hour days for many of their life while still balancing a family. Every dollar they have made has been earned through solid hard work. And while not in every case, it should not be delt out to those who have skipped out on working much, have had little ambition knowing the government will bail them out, or someone who decided to pick up doing drugs and threw their life down the toilet. On the other hand, they more than often donate to charities of all sorts and even find time in their busy schedules to do community work as well. They shouldn't be forced to give a pre-set amount to others who don't make as much. Even if I were to go into a job that I knew would consistantly pay me $30k a year, I would not expect others to come in and pay considerable amounts more than me. Or if I never had a hard day of work in my life, I wouldn't expect those who happend to be going to work every day, working themselves 5x as much as I am to pay a larger amount than me. In ending, I do believe people should be charitable based on their own morale, but should never be forced to pay more based on how much they are paid.

Don't slant this to make me sound evil, but why? Why shouldn't people be allowed to make $500,000 a year. Yeah, it sucks there are people out there struggling to survive but I don't believe it the government's responsibility to redistribute. What about someone who has done nothing short of busting their ass from day 1 to do well in life? They should be required by law to distribute more of their money to people who make less? I believe it is a moral obligation to give to those less fortunate but do not see any reason to be forced to distribute more of your income. My family has done well in life by working 12-15 hour days for many of their life while still balancing a family. Every dollar they have made has been earned through solid hard work. And while not in every case, it should not be delt out to those who have skipped out on working much, have had little ambition knowing the government will bail them out, or someone who decided to pick up doing drugs and threw their life down the toilet. On the other hand, they more than often donate to charities of all sorts and even find time in their busy schedules to do community work as well. They shouldn't be forced to give a pre-set amount to others who don't make as much. Even if I were to go into a job that I knew would consistantly pay me $30k a year, I would not expect others to come in and pay considerable amounts more than me. Or if I never had a hard day of work in my life, I wouldn't expect those who happend to be going to work every day, working themselves 5x as much as I am to pay a larger amount than me. In ending, I do believe people should be charitable based on their own morale, but should never be forced to pay more based on how much they are paid.:1: It's no different than being robbed. Someone sees something that they think they need more than you, and they take it. It's stealing and a crime. When the government takes it and gives it to them... it's fair? WTF is that?

Fine let them take whatever they want, I'll just start robbing poor people to get my money back.

Don't slant this to make me sound evil, but why? Why shouldn't people be allowed to make $500,000 a year.......... but should never be forced to pay more based on how much they are paid.
I totally agree. Social engineering through taxation should end. Why should the rich get tax breaks and the poor a hand up at the middle class's expense? Abolish the current tax code and go with a flat tax or a value added tax like most industrialized country's do.

:lol: Figured that was coming.

Yes, I do believe that people who who make more should not be taxed higher than others. While I do think there should be some support for less income citizens, I don't think it should be brought by mainly those who make more. Like I said, I feel you should have a moral obilgation to give to those you feel were less fortunate in life. In example, people who suffer from an illness who can't afford everything they need, war veterans, those who were in a crisis like hurricane Katrina, etc. I don't think the those who make more should get an exta increase in tax deduction compared to anyone else...do not make that mistake. In fact, I do in believe that those who are considered to be in poverty should get a tax break. It's just a shame that part of those people brought it on themselves.....most certainly not all of them. However, for the rest, I don't believe there should be any redistribution of income or advantages for middle-income citizens, or even low-middle income families. And I have seen first-hand that most people can make a life for themself if they do in fact try. I know people growing up who were given almost nothing, graduated high school, took out student loans for college, graduated and made something of themself. They were given little when they were growing up and nothing when they graduated. And to be honest, in todays society, anyone (disregarding few circumstances) can make a life for themself in this country.

of course not, I'm very aware of this tax since most peeps who work for the man only see half of it deducted from their pay and the man matches it, however I work for my self and pay the full tax in addition to my IRA's and other investments.

How much have you saved up for retirment, or are you just waiting for your social security check?

Not being American, I don't think I'll be relying on living off your SS system.

And while not in every case, it should not be delt out to those who have skipped out on working much, have had little ambition knowing the government will bail them out, or someone who decided to pick up doing drugs and threw their life down the toilet.

Wow, just wow brother. Did you know that minority children are 2 grade levels behind their white peers by 3rd grade? Or that the high school graduation rate for minorities are around 50% compared to near 80% for whites? But yeah, I guess everybody starts in the same place, and it is "laziness, chosen drug use, and lack of ambition" that keep lower income children from succeeding.:headshake


Or if I never had a hard day of work in my life, I wouldn't expect those who happend to be going to work every day, working themselves 5x as much as I am to pay a larger amount than me. In ending, I do believe people should be charitable based on their own morale, but should never be forced to pay more based on how much they are paid.

Those who have profited from an inherently unequal and unjust system have an obligation to put back into the system. A small increase in taxes on the upper 1% of the population will have zero effect on their quality of life, whereas that money can be used to drastically increase the quality of life of low income families. And that's what it's all about, right? A decent quality of life for everyone?

And I have seen first-hand that most people can make a life for themself if they do in fact try. I know people growing up who were given almost nothing, graduated high school, took out student loans for college, graduated and made something of themself. They were given little when they were growing up and nothing when they graduated. And to be honest, in todays society, anyone (disregarding few circumstances) can make a life for themself in this country.

Ahhh, the cold war American dream. Rags to riches... anybody can work their way to the top if they really just try, because all it takes is hard work. Everybody is equal in Ameri... lol, I can't even finish typing it. Anybody who has spent even a short period of time in low income communities knows of the serious racial, social, and economic discrimination inherent in "the system". One could not even begin to make the argument that low income families can simply work their way out of poverty, because it is just not a reality. THEY DO NOT HAVE EQUAL ACCESS AND OPPORTUNITIES. PERIOD. Not even close.

Haha, funny you mention that. My best friend in fact came from a family that made next to nothing. He and his siblings hardly had a rags to riches "American Dream". Give me a break. As I said, if you can get this, they were given nothing, after high school and next to nothing during it. I would imagine you have a hard time concieving this as I was someone who came from a family that did well. And that is they streotype we have been made in since day 1. I know of classmates that were put in jail for breaking in and stealing from a local grocery store. Everyone said they just came from a bad background though. If I try and make a move saying anything about this someone like you is always on my case. It's like we don't have a chance to voice without being evil. And I see as always race is a factor. :rolleyes: So what is it in fact that you want from us? I know there is nothing I can say that you can't put in a derogatory context. And while I am one of the few on here who does not site some website (nor forge one as my own), I do have my own personal experience with those who have lived a life of given nothing. Let's talk race. I have also have a Mexican friend who has lived in a trailer his entire life. In high school he hung out with us, and was considered a friend. His family was straight broke most of his life. Some of us used to chip in just to get him something at lunch-time. He still worked hard through school, took out some loans, and is attending a college here in the state (which for the life of me I cannot remember the name). And while I do not deny there is no prejudice left in society (including the prejudcie of whites if I can say so without being hammered). I have seen everything from whites hating blacks to blacks hating whites for no reason. It does nothing but sadden me. Those previous thoughts are my beliefs and I see nothing wrong with them. And as I also said, there are some certain situations in which I can see some financial aid is needed. Sorry if you don't see from my same perspective.

Was this not political enough? If not feel free to criticize me in any way you see fit. And as Blazee said, how is this different from stealing? The government says so? I guess. I still do my annual summer church camp where I help out in organizing and taking out the plan of the camp. But none of this will ever be enough...right? You make more you give more by law...yeah that's what we should do. And as I said, it is clear that you can put an evil slant on that so go ahead. It's nothing I haven't seen thus far.

I think people are looking at it all wrong from get go. Nobody is saying lets take money from the rich and give it to the poor. All anybody wants to do is raise taxes for the rich. The government already "shares the wealth" with everybody in a number of ways.
If the government literally took money from the rich and handed it over to the poor, then yes I would have a problem with that.
But the government takes money from everybody, and basically hands it back to everybody.
If anybody wants to cry about socialism - how about they build their own highways and roads with their own money and see how that works out.
So if "joe the plumber" has a problem with giving money back to the country he makes his money off of, well - nobody's asking him to stay in this country.