Sebring Chatter

The race is still over a month away but lets talk about it here

Let us hope that the biggest factory threats to Porsche dominance of the GT category come out of the woodwork and annihilate the flat-six menace.

Of course, I'm speaking of the Ferrari 360GT's, the rumored BMW M3 V-8 replacement, (Porsche should be ashamed for raising their little bitch fit over the creation of this car. I mean, they circumvented the GT1 production regulations by using a 911 unibody, even though it was bolted to a carbon plank with a 962 drivetrain. Fuck Stuttgart if they can't handle tasting their own recipe for domination. Moving on). There's also the notably powerful and now recognized as a full-production vehicle by the ACO Mosler MT900, the potent Nissan 350Z GT, and my personal favorote.. the car that will be victorious and look good doing it... the MORGAN AERO 8! :angel: Now there's true greatness lying in wait.

As for the other categories... ehh. *shrugs* GTS should be interesting because of the Prodrive Ferrari 575 Maranellos. They say that the reliabilty issues are worked out. If so, Corvette will have to stare at Cavaillano Rampante for 12 hours. Not a horrible situation for tifosi like me.

LMP675... which Lola chassis wins today? And who honestly cares? Well, I care about the MG-Lolas as an MG owner. But, again... ehh.

LMP900... BAN FUCKING AUDI! Remember Can-Am? The Porsche-Audi 917-30 as campaigned by Team Penske went undefeated in all the races it finished. No one could afford to pour that much money into an effort that had no production justification, so the series, America's ultimate road racing series, died. If the ACO hadn't fucked with the formula, we could've kept GTP or GT1 around and had massive factory efforts with real racing at the front. Tell me again why they're so hopelessly obsessed with trying to make the open cars faster? Manufacturers, the moneyspenders, don't want to build cars people don't recognize as theirs for sportscar racing.

Cars like the R8 do more damage to sportscar racing than good. They turn the races into drawn out, dull, mindless processions. Panoz, Dome, Cadillac, and Chrysler have all tried, but couldn't jusify the scratch for an open wedge with their name on it. DaimlerChrysler decided they'd rather have Oreca spend the season developing the next generation of Vipers than develop the Dallara chassis. Why? Because the marketability of the car couldn't justify the cost of making it an Audi-fighter. Of course, the joke of it is that when the Doran/Lista team from the Grand-Am came over with the same chassis, but powered by the trusty old Judd engine, the car (which turned out to be faster than the "all mighty" Audis) was given such ludicrous restrictions that Doran?Lista gave the ALMS and the ACO the grand "fuck-off" and went back to the Grand-Am.

Is it just me, or is the ALMS trying to go the way of the USRRC and IMSA? Oh wait, isn't it the same idiot?

dude you wrote a hell of alot :P


anyway, everyone is assuming that the corvette did nothing over the off season juust wait and see guys :P


as for audi being banned, its allittle late now that the factory team is out and the champion car is done.

hey vetteeman how do you put all those stars in your name?

Im a Moderator

Sebring entrry list (http://www.imsaracing.net/imsa.cfm?h=/2003/events/sebring/header.htm&p=/2003/events/sebring/entrylist.htm )


Looks like that slow GT Callaway is back but look! a Lamborghini in the GT class! what did I tell ya guys!

I stand Corrected! I E-Mailed shane lewis and he had this to say...

"Completely new car. They may use the frame only from the original Callaway but that would be all. Not even the sub frames will be used.
Shane"


So its an accualy C5-R not a callaway! awesome!:sun:

*sighs* Light year.

The Spyker is a godsend. I'm bummed that the Morgan won't be there. And that many Ferraris means that there has to be a Prancing Horse on the podium, but that doesn't mean anythng if it isn't a triumph over mortal enemies.

God, I wanted a flat out fight this year. This is pale, Matra-versus-Shadow era nothingness. This is Can-Am after they took away the wafer-thin rulebook. This is the sort of thing that keeps killing sportscar racing in America.

We should've HAD a DTM or BTCC or JGTC style series in the states by now. What do we have? An Audi parade, that's finally being disrupted for a Bentley parade, a poor man's battle for yesteryear's equipment (Grand-Am, though I like the Daytona Prototypes. Maserati/Picchio rings true to me, sort of a current 330P4, if you will), glorified SCCA Street Stock, and the Trans-Am becoming an out-of-touch rich boy's playground with anachronistic machines (just tell me where to get my Jaguar XK-8 with the carburetted pushrod Ford engine, guys). It's no wonder nobody cares that NA$CAR stockers have nothing to do with any American production car, no other race form has them, either.

i for one disagree, Its surviaval of the fittest, i would like to see more manufatuurers get in and less privateers.

That's what I would like as well, Vetteman. But I don't want to see seventy of the same car. I want diversity. I want the envelope pushed. I want Can-Am, or Group C, or GT1. Not this FARCE of sportscar racing that threatens IMSA yet again with extinction.

I don't dislike IMSA. They send American teams to Le Mans, which alone sets them head and shoulders above the rest. But they try too hard to keep the manufacturers they have and not hard enough to attract new manufacturers. If the Oreca/Dallara/Chrysler venture taught us anything, it's that manufacturers don't care to build open LMP's. There's no feasible tie-in to production cars, and development is fundamentally idiotic. Why in the world would any company want to funnel that much research into aerodynamics that divert air away from an open cockpit when such cars make up the barest percentile of production? There's no development justification, the rules are biased against production engines (Cadillac Northstar, for example) and the exposure still isn't there for a whole season.

If the Lista/Dallara/Judd combo had swept the Petit le Mans last year as expected before the restrictions were placed upon it, then Audi would have had to stay on another year to further their R8 project because they lost face to a ten year old engine and second-hand chassis. That would have meant Panoz would've had to work harder to sort the bugs out of their LMP2, which in turn would have shown Cadillac that they don't need to copy the Audis to make a quick car and could continue development of their LMP. With a privateer team, running a race shop's chassis as opposed to a factory effort, teams like Dome and Courage would venture over from the continent wanting to give it a shot. Instead of a field of three top drawer cars, you have a race of ten.

Remember seeing GTP coverage and there being AAR Toyotas, Nissans, Silk Cut Jaguars, Mazda 787s, Peugeots, Chevy Intrepids, Porsches of every ilk , Mercedes, Courages, Probes, Marchs, and the list went on? That's what IMSA needs again. The states are hungry for sports cars, why not encourage limitless development, limitless speed. GT1 had it. The Toyota TSO20, Merceded CLK-GTR, Panoz Esperante GTR, McLaren F1, Lotus Elise GT1, and Nissan R390 were the stuff dreams were made of and had the crowd appeal to prove it. They were exotics that made the blood boil and the jaw drop. They were cars that could be found on the street, but were beyond the hands of mere mortals. You dreamed of having a 911GT1 in your garage. Who dreams of a formless wedge?

hehe I for one would like to own one of those cars :P maybe someday....


But yeah your right, if I could chose any car running at lemans last year ide take the C5-R:)

taking a car from last year....it would be the prodrive ferrari. that was a nice car. as for audi being banned.....they should not be banned. they have already been banned enought b/c of the quattro system. you can/t ban them for everything. instead, put some thing like added weights. audi spent the $$, time, and they got rewarded. as for racing the the US.....when ppl's atention get away from nascar/cart/irl then we may be a series like BTCC, or JGTC or something like that

Yes, Xerxes, Audi spent the time and money. But has anyone noticed how conveniently it works out that they (and Porsche) join a series towards the tail end of its life? In fact, the all conquering Porsche 917-30's campaigned by Roger Penske were a Porsche-Audi project. One that KILLED CAN-AM. Audi is a motorsports leech and an incredibly spoile one at that. They never break ground in a class, leaving that to enterprising chassis shops and more spirited companies like BMW, Lotus, or Panoz. Instead, they take advantage of self-created grey area in the rules and apply all the ideas they learn from watching everyone else fight and compete and struggle and put on a helluva show, then come in, dominate, and kill off any chances of there being competition.

As for having the money. If Audi wants to impress the world with how deep its coffers are, then start a fucking Formula One team. Toyota did it. Renault is doing it. Honda is investigating it. Now, Audi can keep at playing big fish in a small pond in the ACO and ALMS, or it can show that it's more than an autocratic bully in the gentleman's world of sportscars and play with the real big boys. I keep using the example of the GTP and Can-AM eras because these were the best times for sportscars in the States. The GT1 era had all the makings of being exactly this. Now, it's little more than an expensive footnote to the WSC concept disaster. It'll be a long time before manufacturers get excited about Le Mans top class again. The last time they tried the rug was pulled out from underneath them to save the ACO's face.

I just checked the updated entry list and it looks like there will be more excitement; everything of interest is bolded:

In P900:
Audi will be back again, Bentley will be there, a Lister prototype will be there, Panoz, Reynard, R&S, Lola, Dallara powered by MG, and a Norma.

In P675:
A Reynard/McLaren, Lola, Pilbeam....

In GTS:
The Vettes are back, as are the Ferraris, Vipers, and Saleens.......and aZonda. This should be awesome!! I'm still going for the Vettes, though.

GT:
Porsche parade again, as well as Ferrari, a C5-R, an M3 (probably a V6 though), the Spyker, a TVR, a Lambo, a Panoz, and the Morgan

Looks to be more exciting than last year. Hopefully Nissan and Mazda will join later this year...

Originally posted by hakka
I'm still going for the Vettes, though.


Me too :P

I could be wrong but I thought I read that the Corvette entered in the GT class is not a C5-R but more or so a race prepared ZO6. Similar to the 550 Maranello (not the Olive Garden or Prodrive) that raced a few races in the GT class last year.

Also the M3's (if they are both entered this year) are supposed to be the same two from last year that were running the production based straight six. Is the correct?

its name is C5-R but no it isnt remotely the same as the factory corvettes

Good deal, thanks for the info.

Octagon said:

[audi] never break ground in a class

Well, they did bring 4wd to Trans-am. Look where that got them... Banned after one season, because everybody elsewhined, instead of engineering a proper response.

Audi wins because they put more effort then anyone else. Sure, it is nice that more manufacturer put their chips in, but let's not forget that these same manufacturer are controlled by pencil pusher and that if the wind is not blowing in their favour, they do like spoiled brats and go play elsewhere. Cadillac and Chrysler being the prime examples here.

That said, I agree that a GT1-like format is much better image-wise. You are entirely correct that people more readily accept race cars that look like cars (even if the resemblance is rather thin).

As for american road racing, if the powers-that-be understood anything, Trans-am would look like Australian V-8 supercars, instead of the over-wide shoe boxes that race today.