Does 95 water pump give pre-failure warning?
tripletdaddy
11-03-2007, 05:20 AM
After reading other's posts on pump going bad at 147k and the blades wear down mysteriously ( maybe on the 3.8 in the Taurus), I'm now curious, concerned about the imminent failure of mine. I know of the common symptoms of pre or near pump failure, but does anyone know of symptoms that have been common or unique to the Windstar? I think searcherrr said his went at 147k most likely due to I think a new belt, assuming bearing failure occured.
Thanks
Thanks
wiswind
11-03-2007, 06:58 PM
I am not aware of any early warning, although it would be nice.
I am at about 190K miles on my original water pump, on my '96 3.8L.
Of course, if there is any coolant leaking from around the bearing.....then failure is certain, as the coolant will ruin the bearing.
I did read about water pump blades in one of the other FORD vehicles being eaten away by the coolant, which had become acidic, which happens as coolant gets old.
This problem can be prevented by changing the coolant every 2 years.
I am at about 190K miles on my original water pump, on my '96 3.8L.
Of course, if there is any coolant leaking from around the bearing.....then failure is certain, as the coolant will ruin the bearing.
I did read about water pump blades in one of the other FORD vehicles being eaten away by the coolant, which had become acidic, which happens as coolant gets old.
This problem can be prevented by changing the coolant every 2 years.
searcherrr
11-03-2007, 07:51 PM
After reading other's posts on pump going bad at 147k and the blades wear down mysteriously ( maybe on the 3.8 in the Taurus), I'm now curious, concerned about the imminent failure of mine. I know of the common symptoms of pre or near pump failure, but does anyone know of symptoms that have been common or unique to the Windstar? I think searcherrr said his went at 147k most likely due to I think a new belt, assuming bearing failure occured.
Thanks
YES.
As experience has shown me very recently after my pump just failed last week while towing there is a way to know if the water pump is going bad and it finally failing I believe was exacerbated by making IMPROVEMENTS under the hood. I have finally come full corner and seen why if you start working on one part of the vehicle you better be prepared to work on, replace, or at least be aware of the other components it is directly connected to as they are all affected. In my situation I replaced the belt tensioner, idler pulley, the belt itself, ps pump (with new pulley)... and part of doing all that wasn't just cause I needed to, but because I was chasing a VERY AGGRAVATING SQUEAK SQUEAK. The behavior specifically with my 95 GL is that it will squeak like mad on EVERY cold start up and sometimes intermittently during operating temp, but usually goes away completely when you are at operating temp while driving. I say my preventative maintenance exacerbated it going bad cause the new tensioner, new belt, and other new associated pulleys all put a NEW feel on the belt/pulley system and it was too much strain for the OLD original OE water pump. I went with a Duralast GOLD Water Pump from Autozone I believe and afterwards it even idled and reved MUCH MUCH MUCH noticeably better and for the first time ever the SQUEAK was finally GONE completely!!!! I wish I could've had someone tell me that it was probably the water pump making the squeaking sounds or that I would've put a scope to the engine to see where it was coming from prior rather than blindly replacing pulleys..... but here I was doing PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE and I thereby caused the water pump to go out probably sooner than it would've. One thing is for sure though.... at 157k even if I had not been towing like I was at the time and even if I had not ever replaced all those other things prior.... it (the wp) still was on borrowed time anyway.
NO matter what you think about the water pump and no matter how many times you've coolant flushed professionally with a pump or on your own at home I would think its safe to say you should replace the water pump every 100k - 120k miles at a minimum. It is a HUGE job and if you are going to do it as preventative maintenance then I highly suggest you prepare for it ahead of time $$$$$$$-wise. It will cost you in the neighborhood of $400 - $700 depending on who you go with and if you replace more than the pump itself. In my situation I had the radiator replaced too and the thermostat and pressured checked the system and it all came to about $1000 at FORD using my own obtained parts from Autozone and Advance. People rib on Autozone a lot, but I have had good experiences with their Duralast and Duralast GOLD brands on more than just my Windstar.
So moral of the story is if you are chasing a squeaking sound and you cannot figure out what it is especially after replacing the same items/pulleys I have ... its likely the Water Pump ESPECIALLY if you are over 100k miles which most of us probably are.
I sincerely hope this helps save some of you some serious cash by catching this before it causes other major failure as I not only lost the radiator, but now I'm looking at a new engine or new vehicle all because of a water pump that costs $60 - $80 and $400 - $700 to replace.
Thanks
YES.
As experience has shown me very recently after my pump just failed last week while towing there is a way to know if the water pump is going bad and it finally failing I believe was exacerbated by making IMPROVEMENTS under the hood. I have finally come full corner and seen why if you start working on one part of the vehicle you better be prepared to work on, replace, or at least be aware of the other components it is directly connected to as they are all affected. In my situation I replaced the belt tensioner, idler pulley, the belt itself, ps pump (with new pulley)... and part of doing all that wasn't just cause I needed to, but because I was chasing a VERY AGGRAVATING SQUEAK SQUEAK. The behavior specifically with my 95 GL is that it will squeak like mad on EVERY cold start up and sometimes intermittently during operating temp, but usually goes away completely when you are at operating temp while driving. I say my preventative maintenance exacerbated it going bad cause the new tensioner, new belt, and other new associated pulleys all put a NEW feel on the belt/pulley system and it was too much strain for the OLD original OE water pump. I went with a Duralast GOLD Water Pump from Autozone I believe and afterwards it even idled and reved MUCH MUCH MUCH noticeably better and for the first time ever the SQUEAK was finally GONE completely!!!! I wish I could've had someone tell me that it was probably the water pump making the squeaking sounds or that I would've put a scope to the engine to see where it was coming from prior rather than blindly replacing pulleys..... but here I was doing PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE and I thereby caused the water pump to go out probably sooner than it would've. One thing is for sure though.... at 157k even if I had not been towing like I was at the time and even if I had not ever replaced all those other things prior.... it (the wp) still was on borrowed time anyway.
NO matter what you think about the water pump and no matter how many times you've coolant flushed professionally with a pump or on your own at home I would think its safe to say you should replace the water pump every 100k - 120k miles at a minimum. It is a HUGE job and if you are going to do it as preventative maintenance then I highly suggest you prepare for it ahead of time $$$$$$$-wise. It will cost you in the neighborhood of $400 - $700 depending on who you go with and if you replace more than the pump itself. In my situation I had the radiator replaced too and the thermostat and pressured checked the system and it all came to about $1000 at FORD using my own obtained parts from Autozone and Advance. People rib on Autozone a lot, but I have had good experiences with their Duralast and Duralast GOLD brands on more than just my Windstar.
So moral of the story is if you are chasing a squeaking sound and you cannot figure out what it is especially after replacing the same items/pulleys I have ... its likely the Water Pump ESPECIALLY if you are over 100k miles which most of us probably are.
I sincerely hope this helps save some of you some serious cash by catching this before it causes other major failure as I not only lost the radiator, but now I'm looking at a new engine or new vehicle all because of a water pump that costs $60 - $80 and $400 - $700 to replace.
tripletdaddy
11-03-2007, 11:46 PM
OK,... So I need to keep my ears out for that annoying, elusive squeak. Hopefully we all can get something useful from your experience, however unfortunate and expensive for you. Thanks
tomj76
11-06-2007, 10:40 AM
In my experience, water pumps have two closely related failure points... the seal and the bearing.
If you notice any liquid dripping from the water pump shaft, then your seal has probably failed and the bearings will soon fail, possibly catastrophically. However, it's important to make sure that the water is due to a failed water pump seal, and not another point. I had a leak recently that I thought was from the pump, but on closer inspection I found it was coming from the front cover. Also, I've read that some Ford water pumps have weep holes in their seal to allow small amounts of coolant that manage to get past the first seal to drain away from the shaft.
It's true that a squeaking pump can be a sign of impending failure. Be careful in isolating squeaks coming from the pulleys of the engine. I find that an acoustic tile can be use to isolate the source of a squeak if it's used to shield the sound different areas of the engine.
If you hear a more course sound then the bearings have corroded and they will soon seize. A stethoscope is helpful for finding rough bearings, and I've also used a long socket extension (other long metal bar) to hear a bad bearing. I put one end of the bar on the part of the car I want to hear and the other next to my ear. Make sure to keep hands, loose clothing, jewelry, and hair away from the moving parts at the front of the car.
If you notice any liquid dripping from the water pump shaft, then your seal has probably failed and the bearings will soon fail, possibly catastrophically. However, it's important to make sure that the water is due to a failed water pump seal, and not another point. I had a leak recently that I thought was from the pump, but on closer inspection I found it was coming from the front cover. Also, I've read that some Ford water pumps have weep holes in their seal to allow small amounts of coolant that manage to get past the first seal to drain away from the shaft.
It's true that a squeaking pump can be a sign of impending failure. Be careful in isolating squeaks coming from the pulleys of the engine. I find that an acoustic tile can be use to isolate the source of a squeak if it's used to shield the sound different areas of the engine.
If you hear a more course sound then the bearings have corroded and they will soon seize. A stethoscope is helpful for finding rough bearings, and I've also used a long socket extension (other long metal bar) to hear a bad bearing. I put one end of the bar on the part of the car I want to hear and the other next to my ear. Make sure to keep hands, loose clothing, jewelry, and hair away from the moving parts at the front of the car.
busboy4
11-06-2007, 10:57 AM
Hi
I hear you on improvements causing other problems. I had my water pump fail, actually the shaft seal after completing the lower intake manifold repair. I had no prior noise or cooling issues. But after completing the manifold job, closing things up and refilling, the shaft immediately began leaking. Profusely I might add. I suppose the seal was weak and did not like being high and dry for a few days. Just speculation.
I hear you on improvements causing other problems. I had my water pump fail, actually the shaft seal after completing the lower intake manifold repair. I had no prior noise or cooling issues. But after completing the manifold job, closing things up and refilling, the shaft immediately began leaking. Profusely I might add. I suppose the seal was weak and did not like being high and dry for a few days. Just speculation.
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