Z31 engine swaps

OK, so i was sitting here thinking about the car of my dreams and the Z31 is it. IMO it is one of the best looking cars out. But the performance is well, not that great. I want to get a 240SX and turbo it, but later on in life when i have a place of my own, out of colledge, and a steady job, i want a car to seriously make spectacular, a Z31. So heres the question, what are some engine swaps that are not like an extreme thing to do. How about a turbo KA swap. I want your opinions, and i would never go bigger than a V6.

swapping in any 4 cylinder engine into the z31 would be shooting yourself in the foot with a rocket launcher.

for high performance there is nothing more than a vg30et needed... rebuild the internals with z32 rods and forged pistons, and do some headwork and the engine is good to 600+hp, now that's with supporting mods of course...

and as for the 'performance is not that great' you've obviously never ridden in one that's got <$1000 worth of mods in it (exhaust intake and boost controller)... on a cool day with good high octane gas it can rival the acceleration of a 350z...

if you absolutely must swap an engine, look into the rb series... the rb20det would be the easiest seeing as they came stock in the 200zr in japan, would only require a front clip or some custom mounting and so on.... next up is the rb25det or 26dett, both will require quite and extensive amount of fabrication and custom work and isn't really worth it unless you're going for the show car or unique(and extremely expensive) look

if you're that much into 4 bangers, i'd stay with the lighter 240sx/sylvia chassis.

don't forget a vg33et swap (I think that's the engine)... 10% more displacement right
???

yeah that's true, from a pathfinder... need to replace a bunch of stuff if you want it to run well turbocharged (cams mostly) and there would need to be something done about the intake manifold (or lower the engine down with some poly mounts) but yes, fully built it would be the better engine

so how much work is it to swap the z323 internals in????
just swap or custom ground????
also what about connecting rod and piston seat hight is there a maching required to top of pistons tom not extrude from the top of the block???
if not its of to ebay i go (lol)

well the engine I'm thinking of was offered in the fairlady z31's ... I thought it was the vg33e but I could be wrong...

i believe the z32 rods are a direct bolt on if you use the z32 pistons... i think they work with the 87-89 pistons as well, but running the 84-86 engines you'd have to change a few things... can't remember what it is, but the ring lands on the stock pistons start to shatter at around 450hp, and the z32's pistons are good to around 500rwhp before they start breaking, so going with some nice forged pistons on top of the z32 rods will net you a 700+ rwhp setup..

i don't believe there was any vg bigger than 3 litre offered in japan... i know there was a vg20e/t offered there, and the rb series rb20det, but i don't think there was ever a vg33 that came stock in a 300zx

well in the turbo FAQ at z31.com they say that if you can, get a vg33et engine from Japan becuase it has like 10% more displacement...

" If you're going to build an engine, do it right. Start with a vg33 to get the extra 10% displacement over a vg30 and you'll have 10% more power for free! Good pistons to lower the 9:1 vg33 compression ratio and good cams to replace the low-speed cam grind used in trucks and you've got a pretty good engine. Rebello, Sunbelt, and Malvern racing all build wonderfull Nissan engines, expect to pay around $5k for a basic high-quality reliable streetable engine."

from the 'new' turbo faq

^that's the one I was thinking of... I thought it was offered in Japan... meh I guess not, thanks for the clear up

Drop a VG30DE in, and start working on that. A more efficient engine will respond much better to mods later on than the SOHC VG.
The VG30DE already makes 20+hp more than the stock VG30ET. The twin turbo makes 100hp more. Its clear to see which engine is going to respond much better to modifications.

Grab the VG30DE, get some forged pistons and some big turbos (or a supercharger) and you've now got a car that will beat 99% of cars on the road, and not look like a lame family car.

^ so you're saying that turboing the vg30de would be cheaper than swapping in a vg30dett?

^ so you're saying that turboing the vg30de would be cheaper than swapping in a vg30dett?

Depends on if you're going to be replacing the pistons and turbos anyway.
Swapping in the vg30dett and replacing the components that make it the vg30dett is rather pointless, time consuming and expensive.

^ IDK man, with a stock turbo engine and about 1,000 worth of parts, your practically in TT range... if you spend about 2-3000 bucks with turbo, fuel management, and other misc upgrades you'll be whooping plenty of cars. If you swap in a VG30DE and than turbo that could cost just as much if not more, and be alot more time consuming... just my 2 cents

hush mikey, it would be a bitch to fit and much more expensive overall... would only be worth it imo if you were going for a unique look or major hp.... even then you could always go for the rb26, mind you that'd be a bit more expensive and labour intensive...

bottom line is the vg30(or 33)et is about the best engine you can have in there power to money wise, aside from maybe one of those lame ass v8's...

^lame asss v8s..... hahhaha ROFL

Ahh please Delerious, it fits fine. I just hope you don't value the skin on your arms when you have to reach down the side of it.
As for the straight-edge rocker amongst us with a fine taste in amps, you're missing my point. Sure swapping in a vg30De is going to be far more expensive than moderately building up a vg30ET, but it depends on where you're going to stop. And we all know that once you start, you'll never stop, so why not go for the best you can grab straight up. A VK45DETT would probably be about the best engine that you could get to fit in there, but they're insanely expensive, and probably not quite worth the money at the moment. As far as price goes, i think VG30DEs are quite a respectable swap. Probably about the same potential as a VG30E, but will respond much better to modifications.

-Mike

^just seems more pricey and time consuming to be worth it, but more power to ya...

yeah, the z31 is a pain enough to work on already... i'd hate to see a messily installed de in there... that would be damn near impossible to work on... i'm sticking with my vg30et and eventually building the bejesus out of it... then llz and i will show you what real z31 power is

then llz and i will show you what real z31 power is

:ylsuper:

I'm not going to read all the however many posts I've missed in this thread...I'm just gunna post my :2cents:.

Get a turbo car and mod that engine. Pop the engine out, rebuild it to whatever extent you desire and the world is your oyster. People think little of the little ol' 3L, SOHC, old school VG30ET, but I've seen Z31s haul some SERIOUS NUT SACK with this engine. That's why I'm doing exactly as I describe above. :biggrin: Have fun!

http://z31.com/racing/8secz.jpg

That's just classic...

i never get tired of that picture..

Me neither, really. I use that pic often to illustrate how bad Z31s can be. I've recently found many more that are just as infinatly cool. Found a dude a while back in Cuba (edit: puerto rico...my bad...) that was running ~9s and the car still LOOKED street legal and probably was...

No tubbed wheel wells (notice stock rims in pic), no goofy wing(s), no wheelie bars...car looked completely stock...THIS is my goal...look stock, retain every day drive-ability, retain as much of the stock interior and remain somewhat comfortable to drive and ride in.

http://www.dragtimes.com/Nissan-300ZX-Timeslip-365.html

That dude is the SHIT! And I've recently found out who does his head porting...geee...wonder who I'll look into doing mine...wink wink... :biggrin:

^The best part is the temperature that day... 99 degrees Farenheight!!!!!!!

^The best part is the temperature that day... 99 degrees Farenheight!!!!!!!

No joke...I noticed that, too. Imagine if the dude was running in 50 or 60 degrees!

yeah, the best part about that is the stock transmission

That dude's my idol. lol

Wait! i never knew you could use the Z31 Rods and pistons in the Z31. Im guessing they need to be the TT ones? What HP #'s are they holding up to?

If I'm not mistaken, they're good for 500+. I think they're forged.

Wait! i never knew you could use the Z31 Rods and pistons in the Z31. Im guessing they need to be the TT ones? What HP #'s are they holding up to?

rods will hold up to 600rwhp+ and yes they are forged but the Z32 pistons (being cast) are not that stout. on the Z32 they need to be replaced to run over 17-18psi of boost for your motor to still be reliable, i dont know how this relates to the Z31.

but yes, the VG30E can be built with Z32 parts. virtually the same block, but most i would recommend just to buy wiseco forged pistons for the Z32 which will raise the compression to almost 8.7:1 compared the stock 7.?. you can use stock rods or forged if your plans arent to go over 600rwhp. anyways, i think the wiseco's offer 2 different sizes that require a .020 or .030 over for the Z32. so it will be a nice bore the Z31.

also, Z31 bearings are an upgraded bearing for the Z32 because it is made of a harder metal but it is less forgiving than the Z32 bearings. i dont think this is a popular route, so before i spend thousands on a rebuild i would like some research done on the subject before i ever throw them in my engine. though "Toga" bearings are looking pretty good...:lol:

i honestly think that anyone building VG30ET should consider the escort's VG34ET. that price seems very reasonable to me. but then again their VG32DET for the Z32 also seems very reasonable with all of the parts that are going into it and all of the work they do. very impressive prices for a company like that...

out of curiosity: what motor is in that 8 second Z31? it wouldnt surprise me if it was one of you Z31 owner's despised american made V8 powering that car. whatever it is...nice tub job on the rear wheel wells. :D

That VG34ET is way over kill. It's not necessary to spend that much money to get crazy power out of the VG30ET. I sure as hell won't. I mean...hell...isn't that engine like...11 grand or something crazy? But hey...if you have no budget, go for it. I'm not even going to overbore mine unless the cylinder walls need cleaned up. I probably wont' even spend 5 grand on mine.

That VG34ET is way over kill. It's not necessary to spend that much money to get crazy power out of the VG30ET. I sure as hell won't. I mean...hell...isn't that engine like...11 grand or something crazy? But hey...if you have no budget, go for it. I'm not even going to overbore mine unless the cylinder walls need cleaned up. I probably wont' even spend 5 grand on mine.
i think the motor is like $5k. thats what i was saying...surprisingly cheap for what it is.

actually... as a matter of fact, the rods in the z31 are forged as well... if you have what is known as a 'w-series' engine in your z31 then feel free to boost the bejesus out of it... stock the internals are good to about 500hp before the ring lands start to shatter... i was pleased to learn this... the w-series motor was put in the 87-89's exclusively i believe, i'm not sure if all of the turbo's got one or not, i have yet to check if mine's a w-series engine, when i get around to it i'll be sure to be crossing my fingers that it is one....

How do you know if you have a "W" series motor? and was it ever used int he 86? or just 87-89? thanks! :)

there's a serial number on a plate at the back of the engine on the passenger's side that's either stamped with an "AXXXXX" or "BXXXXXX" for the regular engines or "WXXXXXX" for the w series engine

actually... as a matter of fact, the rods in the z31 are forged as well... if you have what is known as a 'w-series' engine in your z31 then feel free to boost the bejesus out of it... stock the internals are good to about 500hp before the ring lands start to shatter... i was pleased to learn this... the w-series motor was put in the 87-89's exclusively i believe, i'm not sure if all of the turbo's got one or not, i have yet to check if mine's a w-series engine, when i get around to it i'll be sure to be crossing my fingers that it is one....
sweet deal...still cast pistons eh?

yeah, unfortunately... oh well... $600 for pistons is still a lot cheaper than $600 for pistons and however much for rods :p

yeah, unfortunately... oh well... $600 for pistons is still a lot cheaper than $600 for pistons and however much for rods :p
yeah, wiseco charges $5?? for pistons and Eagle charges $6?? for rods. and they are the cheapest you can get.

i think the motor is like $5k. thats what i was saying...surprisingly cheap for what it is.

Yea...but that's for JUST the motor! Not counting the turbo and all related hardware (another grand or so...around 1500 for what I have in mind...:evillol:) any other external stuff (ignition parts, intake parts, exhaust parts, etc) or installation. I'm shooting to have my engine built, running and installed for around that much...

Oh...and the W series VG30E(T) was only found in Z31s from 4/87 on...so if you have an earlier 87, you still get the shaft. Don't mean to shit on anyone's parade...

This is one of the many reasons why that '89 I found was SO fucking sweet....

there's a serial number on a plate at the back of the engine on the passenger's side that's either stamped with an "AXXXXX" or "BXXXXXX" for the regular engines or "WXXXXXX" for the w series engine Thanks alot! :grinyes:

Oh...and the W series VG30E(T) was only found in Z31s from 4/87 on...so if you have an earlier 87, you still get the shaft.
Ehhh...not so much. ;)
Check this out: The guy I bought my Z from said that he swapped a motor from an '87 300ZX and put it in my '85 car. There was no way to tell if he was telling the truth (as far as I knew) until the motor was out.
Well guess what?! The motor is out, (and has been for a while...) I checked the block today, and voila! There's a big 'W' smiling back at me!
How sweet is that?!
The number is: 005474W

i can't seem to find the stamping.... where are you looking? :D lol

Lol, the passenger side deck is where I found it

Ehhh...not so much. ;)
Check this out: The guy I bought my Z from said that he swapped a motor from an '87 300ZX and put it in my '85 car. There was no way to tell if he was telling the truth (as far as I knew) until the motor was out.
Well guess what?! The motor is out, (and has been for a while...) I checked the block today, and voila! There's a big 'W' smiling back at me!
How sweet is that?!
The number is: 005474W

Well yea...anything could have a W series in it if you put one in it...lol...

Well yea...anything could have a W series in it if you put one in it...lol...
Lol, so?! What's your point?!?! ;)

Yea...but that's for JUST the motor! Not counting the turbo and all related hardware (another grand or so...around 1500 for what I have in mind...:evillol:) any other external stuff (ignition parts, intake parts, exhaust parts, etc) or installation. I'm shooting to have my engine built, running and installed for around that much...


yes, but you still will not have a professionally, highest quality parts, built VG33ET.

they way i see it... that motor, a properly sized turbo, custom manifolds, custom intercooler setup, custom intake, and larger fuel injectors could make one of the most responsive HIGH HP set-ups on a Z31. think of the extra response you would get from having another .3L spinning that turbo, response would be amazing. and it may be more expensive than other set-ups but i bet this set-up would be absolutely mind boggling for the money.

yes, but you still will not have a professionally, highest quality parts, built VG33ET.

they way i see it... that motor, a properly sized turbo, custom manifolds, custom intercooler setup, custom intake, and larger fuel injectors could make one of the most responsive HIGH HP set-ups on a Z31. think of the extra response you would get from having another .3L spinning that turbo, response would be amazing. and it may be more expensive than other set-ups but i bet this set-up would be absolutely mind boggling for the money.

The only time your theory would actually apply is if you only have one setup that you can use for whatever reason...then you'd need to make the motor fit it. Why make the engine fit the turbo system if you don't have to? Make the turbo system fit the engine you're using. This is much easier to do. Use what works. It all depends on the turbo and turbo setup you're using. If you have a 3L, use a turbo setup that works well for a 3L...if you have a 3.3L engine, use a turbo setup that will work well with such...response is not an issue either way.

the engine from amz is a 3.4 litre btw

Meh...3.3L...3.4L...I hit the wrong button...or had one too many beers...er something...

The only time your theory would actually apply is if you only have one setup that you can use for whatever reason...then you'd need to make the motor fit it. Why make the engine fit the turbo system if you don't have to? Make the turbo system fit the engine you're using. This is much easier to do. Use what works. It all depends on the turbo and turbo setup you're using. If you have a 3L, use a turbo setup that works well for a 3L...if you have a 3.3L engine, use a turbo setup that will work well with such...response is not an issue either way.

dude, i am not speaking theory...

i am not making a motor fit anything...i am informing you that increasing the displacement is gonna give you better performance while retaining a low compression ratio for boost. its proven...

it doesnt matter what turbo system you pick, the better the motor and the more displacement that motor has, the better performance you are gonna have in any aspect.

response is an issue because if you decide on a turbo setup for your 3.0L, that 3.4L motor is gonna give you that much better performance.

when building a turbocharged car there is an equal balance between N/A power that the engine produces and the power it produces from boost pressure. if you have an engine that doesnt produce much power by itself, you will need to run more boost therefore picking a laggier turbo and the already powerless engine has to somehow spool a bigger turbo up.

now if you build a stronger motor, you can pick a much larger turbo with the same spool up characteristics as the first set-up but your peak HP may have doubled.

i am obviously picking both extremes but it is something to think about.

i am honestly still pondering picking up an Escort bored 3.2L Twin Turbo motor for my build because of this reason. though it will cost my twice as much, the performance will be SO much better. the turbos i am picking up will already spool up nicely and give me peak HP around 700rwhp but can you imagine what that 3.2L motor would do with those same turbos. we are talking much better spool up and even more peak HP because the motor itself is making more power.

the engine from amz is a 3.4 litre btw

yes my fault, the escort motor is bored to 3.4L, even better.

Meh.


Bigger isn't better.


That's also proven.


Too tired.


I can't sleep.


This blows ass.

Meh.


Bigger isn't better.


That's also proven.


Too tired.


I can't sleep.


This blows ass.

:lol: long night?

its cool...i am a firm believer that more displacement is ALWAYS beneficial. though i am not like these americna muscle guys that belive that a motor less than 5.7L cant create HP, i do belive the more displacement you have...the more power you are gonna be able to create and the better that HP is gonna be delivered.

lol...yea man...last night sucked ass. Fucking dogs kept me up all fucking night. It was about 5 in the morning when I made that post and I was completely out of it.

Between my AF friends and I, I am moving out of this apt with my girlfriend as soon as I possibly can. I can't take this any more. I'm currently looking at apartments in downtown Cincinnati and even considering just completely bailing the fuck out of this area and moving to arizona, cali, florida, Boston, NYC or some shit. I also need to talk to the land lord people in this apt about figuring out some way of just switching apts with in this apt complex. I like where I'm at...I just don't really want to share my apt with her and her fucking dogs any more. The apt is in my name so I might just be able to move myself. I'm not sure, though.

Anyway...displacement and raised compression is NOT as good of an option as more boost. I was reading a bit of that Corky Bell book, "Maximum Boost" and he was talking about just this. What I got from what I read was that boost adds a cusioning effect in the cylinders under boost which prolongs the life of a turbo charged engine when compared to that of an NA engine.

Ya know...I don't even know if this has anything to do with what you're saying...I'm still out of it, but I remember this topic coming up in the past...so...yea...I'm going to bed now...in my music room...so I can FUCKING SLEEP!!!

Later guys.

that sucks about the apartment man... i couldn't imagine how annoying one little dog would be, but 2? that's just madness lol... anyway, should consider canada :D

I am moving out of this apt with my girlfriend as soon as I possibly can.

I just don't really want to share my apt with her and her fucking dogs any more.
arent those contradictory statements...they are your Girlfriend's dogs correct? maybe i am missing something.


Anyway...displacement and raised compression is NOT as good of an option as more boost.

who said anything about raising the compression? i believe the escort motor keeps the compression about what it is stock, (eventhough the Z31T could use a little compression bump) i know they do with the VG30DETT.

I was reading a bit of that Corky Bell book, "Maximum Boost" and he was talking about just this. What I got from what I read was that boost adds a cusioning effect in the cylinders under boost which prolongs the life of a turbo charged engine when compared to that of an NA engine.

why would you raise the compression of a TT motor up to N/A standards in a Daily Driven car? yes, Corky is correct. it does take away from reliability because it increases the chance of detonation.

we had this discussion when Stephen P wanted to lower the compression of his already low Z31T compression, and i informed him that, that wasnt going to give him the same effect that he wanted. he would actually be decreasing his performance in a hopeful chance that he creates more power on top end.

all i am saying is that the Escort motor probably creates much better power bands and gives much better top end than an equally built VG30.

ghahbansfghurvnwanbs...ajwinvasigofeot

ghahbansfghurvnwanbs...ajwinvasigofeot
seriously, i got confused...

you want to move out the apartment with your GF because of the dogs. or does the next door neighbor own the dogs and they keep you up. sorry, i must be slow...

his gf owns the dogs dumbass, otherwise why would he have gotten the toy for them to play with?

his gf owns the dogs dumbass, otherwise why would he have gotten the toy for them to play with?
dude, wtf is your problem?

i asked because his post was a little confusing to me. he wants to move in a different apartment within the same complex of his GF? just get rid of the dogs man...:lol:

No no no no, guys...*I* *AM* *MOVING* out...you must have missed that part. She can stay here...she can move...what ever she wants...*I* am leaving, though. Sure...the dogs are amusing at times, but they still are NOT housebroken (one of which is over a year old and the other is 4 mo or something like that now...the younger one may have an excuse but even that is pushin it...with me...I have no fucking tolerance for that shit) and they'll STILL fucking DESTROY the apartment if we leave them out for any length of time. Again...it's mostly the bigger one that'll do this, but still...I'd be surprised if the little one doesn't partake in this.

Also:

They don't let me sleep. THIS will PISS ME OFF faster than JUST ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE EVER...I NEED to sleep and I get FUCKING IRATE if I get waken up all the time when I don't want to be.

Honest to God, D, I'd really like to move to Canada but I have no idea where to go or how to go about going.

No no no no, guys...*I* *AM* *MOVING* out...you must have missed that part. She can stay here...she can move...what ever she wants...*I* am leaving, though. Sure...the dogs are amusing at times, but they still are NOT housebroken (one of which is over a year old and the other is 4 mo or something like that now...the younger one may have an excuse but even that is pushin it...with me...I have no fucking tolerance for that shit) and they'll STILL fucking DESTROY the apartment if we leave them out for any length of time. Again...it's mostly the bigger one that'll do this, but still...I'd be surprised if the little one doesn't partake in this.

Also:

They don't let me sleep. THIS will PISS ME OFF faster than JUST ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE EVER...I NEED to sleep and I get FUCKING IRATE if I get waken up all the time when I don't want to be.

Honest to God, D, I'd really like to move to Canada but I have no idea where to go or how to go about going.

that sucks man and i totally understand. mt gf has 2 dogs and i made her stop bringing both of them for a while because they would get into the garbage all the time and shit. she got on trained, plus the fact that he isnt a puppy anymore so he is good now but the other one is a little shit and he is also a chihuaua (sp?)

id like to move to austrailia or canada also...austrailia is a little more attractive to me right now because of the warm weather. i am taking a vacation to arizona at the end of this summer to see how i like it...anybody know of any peaceful good vacation spots or good places to live. i was thinking maybe the outskirts of flagstaff so i can drive my Z all year round without a glitch and drive up to the mountains and go skiing anytime of the year. that would be awesome...

good luck LLZ. hope you get it all worked out...