Looks - Affordable companies - Who wins?

So, in your personal opinion which car manufacturer aimed to be accessible has the best designs overall?

The company has to have at least one car lower than 35K range.

Euro High End
Bmw
Mercedes Benz
Jaguar
Volvo
Sabb
Audi

Japan High End
Acura (Honda)
Lexus (Toyota)
Infiniti (Nissan)

US High End
Cadillac
Lincoln

European
Mini (Bmw)
Volkswagen

Japanesse/Oriental
Honda
Toyota
Nissan
Subaru
Mitsubishi
Kia
Isuzu
Hyundai
Mazda
Scion
Suzuki

U.S
Ford
Buick
Chevrolet
Chrysler
Dodge
Pontiac

Copy and Paste the manufacturers and share your opinion. Cars you like, cars you hate, company you hate. This is all visual, esthetic, looks.

Peace.
MexSiR

Example: (My personal opinion)

Euro High End
Bmw - Best designs before the introduced the X3. 5 and 6 series (new versions) Bmw in year 2001 was beautiful, with the 3 series 5 series X5.
Mercedes Benz - C class is very nice, but many models almost exactly look the same.
Volvo - Ford influence noticed, O.K designs.
Sabb - Imporved over time, but not the best.
Audi - The new big grill introduced in all models is not very nice. Prior models to the big grill introduction are very nice. A4 is comparable to 3 series looks.

Japan High End
Acura (Honda) - All models are nice looking, they used to be very bland, lacking personality but the lineup now is super nice.
Lexus (Toyota) Only like the IS300
Infiniti (Nissan) G35 is very nice, as well as the truck.

These Jap companies are finally stepping up to the Euros in design.

US High End
Cadillac - Not my taste, although the designs have improved
Lincoln - Not my taste

European
Mini (Bmw) - Nice design, looks more upscale then it should.
Volkswagen - More personality than the Jap companies, VW proabably wins it in the really affordable section.

Japanesse
Honda - They used to have more personality, not ugly and not pretty. Only ones that I like are the Civic and the s2000. Those are nice looking cars.
Toyota - Probably ugliest manufacturer in the world. Dont like any car.
Nissan - Skyline, Altima have good designs.
Subaru - Umm No
Mitsubishi - Umm No No No
Kia - No way jose
Isuzu - Ugly
Hyundai - Nope.
Mazda -A GOOD jap designer, cars are attractive.
Scion - Better than toyota but ummm...No
Suzuki - No way.

U.S
Ford - GT is cool and retro, as well as the new mustang.
Buick - Umm NOO
Chevrolet - Corvette is nice, the new one even more.
Chrysler - Improved designs since mercedes.
Dodge - Viper?
Pontiac - "Aggresive" looking but doesent get to me.

Euro High End
Bmw- E46 and the E39 are still the best looking cars under Porsche pricing IMO, E60 is growing on me, E60 M5 is awesome.
Mercedes Benz- Subtle, not nearly as daring as BMW
Jaguar- Same, classic styling for a long time
Volvo- finally, Volvo moves away from the Box design
Saab- blah, design never changes
Audi- Dont like the snoz on the newer models, good alternative to BMW

Japan High End
Acura (Honda)- Getting better and better, love the TSX, TL, and new RL styling
Lexus (Toyota)- Most boring of all luxury brands, also most common in America...
Infiniti (Nissan)- Not a huge fan of the G35, but its a big improvement on previous designs

US High End
Cadillac- New designs needed because client base was, well, dieing. Not bad, but not that good.
Lincoln- Boring

European
Mini (Bmw)- gotta love the Minis...
Volkswagen- Mk. IV wasnt bad, im trying to get used to mk. V

Japanese
Honda- S2000 looks good, Element doesn't, everything else is neutral
Toyota- most boring car maker in the world
Nissan- 350z and Altima look great
Subaru- never been a fan of the WRX's styling, but I like the new Legacy.
Mitsubishi- like the Evo VIII's styling, nothing else
Kia- tie with Suzuki for worst designs
Isuzu- meh...
Hyundai- getting better, still not that good
Mazda- dont like the RX-8, did like the RX-7 still like the MX-5
Scion- xB is a Box, xA is terrible, tC is best looking under $20k car
Suzuki- Tied with Kia for worst car designs

U.S
Ford- Like where their goin, back to the 60's when their cars were good
Buick- Old People Cars
Chevrolet- Vette looks great as always, not a fan of anything else
Chrysler- 300C looks good for a boat, Xfire not bad either
Dodge- hate the Neon, dislike the Viper
Pontiac- GTO looks like Grand Prix... too boring for a "performance" brand

DinanM3_S2, we have very close views on looks, nice man. Im a huge fan of the M3, you are so lucky to have one! I drive a 323i sometimes, its my mothers awesome car, just a little underpowered. One day ill own an M3 and an s2000.

Peace.

Euro High End
Bmw - as for the love it/hate it styling - i hate it.
Mercedes Benz - most elegant designs of anything in this list
Jaguar - never a big fan of jag, nothing's changed
Volvo - nice seats, not bad looking cars. better than the boxes although give me an 850r anyday. hehe
Sabb - last among the euro high end cars i'd consider, i like the new 9-3's though
Audi - overall very handsome cars. the new A6 looks much better in person than in pics. hopefully the same goes with the new A4 coming out.

Japan High End
Acura (Honda) - big improvement in looks. still a bit conservative but at least they're not bland anymore.
Lexus (Toyota) - *yawn*
Infiniti (Nissan) - definate improvement over the past few years,

US High End
Cadillac - better than lincoln, dare i say i'm growin to like the cts.
Lincoln - worse than cadillac

European
Mini (Bmw) - neutral
Volkswagen - not bad looking cars in general. nothing that stands out, nothing that really turns you off

Japanesse
Honda - too conservative. but the designs age much better than most makes.
Toyota - see lexus above
Nissan - more daring than honda or toyota, some are right on target, others not so much
Subaru - don't like wrx/sti looks. legacy's are alright
Mitsubishi - galant looks ok, eclipse - neutral, lancer - blah (evo - no thanks), the suv's aren't impressive
Kia - for econoboxes, not bad
Isuzu - how this company has survived beats me. neutral on looks
Hyundai - as for looks, they should loook to the tiburon more for inspiration
Mazda - overall good looking cars. can't think of an ugly mazda
Scion - the tc is the only good looking scion IMO
Suzuki - no comment

U.S
Ford - i'm likin the new mustang, the GT is gorgeous, trucks are handsome overall.
Buick - i'll tell you when i'm 60 years old
Chevrolet - the vette is the only car worth mentioning and i like it, trucks aren't bad but i think ford makes better looking trucks overall
Chrysler - 300c makes a bold statement, they should run with it IMO.
Dodge - i think the durango is just oddlooking, rams look like a truck should look like. not all that impressed with the cars. i like the previous gen viper much better lookswise
Pontiac - haven't like a pontiac design in a long time. the new G6's ( i think) look alright though
where's mercury? not that you need to mention them, they're just rebadged fords anyway.

if i were to pick one company that i think is going int he right direction as far as looks, i'd have to say acura. with the TL, the TSX and the new RL coming out, they're all rather nice eimprovements over the cars they replaced. just my $.02

when did kia and hyundai become japanese car brands?
they're south korean car companies

Euro High End
Bmw 3 series is always nice, i like the m3 the best, everything else is a step up
Mercedes Benz nothing really appeals to me, they all look the same -_- nothing really special
Volvo the new s40 is a good car for the price, volvo's reliability is pretty good, the s60r isn't the fastest or the best but its a dam nice car
Saab (not sabb) starting to buy cars from subaru -_- the new hatch, and the upcoming.. minivan or suv or whatever it is
Audi, i love the A4, i always seen it as a nice car, every audi i've been in is nice, i think they should work on the quattro tho, needs a lil more power imo

Japan High End
Acura (Honda) acura is completely changing, the new rsx sucks (not everything about it) the tsx is good, the tl is great, the new rl is also nice, they should replace the nsx soon tho, or atleast upgrade it, its so old
Lexus (Toyota) the lexus brand is getting old, all their cars are boring, even the IS300, they need new cars
Infiniti (Nissan) infinity is moving up with that VQ engine, i can only hope it gets better, alot of people say infiniti's are nowhere near the european cars that they're up against when ti comes to interior, nissan has always had kind of a cheap interior tho

US High End
Cadillac the new.. what is it. the cts? seems pretty good
Lincoln duno much about this company

European
Mini (Bmw) doesn't seem to be getting anywhere
Volkswagen cars have lots of electronical problems, lots of problems early into the cars life, nothing interest me

Japanese
Honda they really gotta make new cars, the brand is so boring, the new truck..? they came late into the truck thing, nissan has the titan, and toyota has alot of trucks, their "sut" concept doesn't loook like it'll do well, the civic si is overpriced, and looks like a mini version of the oddessy
Toyota their new XRS models are attracting mroe buyers, maybe myself as well, the prius hopefully will evolve into an even more efficient car, the celica and the MR2 are guna be gone after 05, but they have 2 concepts coming up, the TXS, and the Volta, or voltra or something
Nissan the new line of their cars are great, but i really wish they'd find a way to inprove upon the sentra/se-r, they destroyed the se-r's looks in 03, went from skyline wannabe to ugly pos
Subaru, the new legacy is GREAT, it was the #2 car in japan for.. i think 2003, i would buy it but i lack the funds, and the Us is also lacking the 3.0liter H6 engine for the legacy, the sti and the wrx are really nice
Mitsubishi the evo, the ralliart, and the eclipses are nice, i dont see that many other mitsubishis around
Isuzu no interest
Mazda they replaced the mazda protege, which imo looked better than the new 6 OR the 3, but the 3 is a nice new line of affordable vehicles
Scion the tC......
Suzuki no interest

U.S *shrugs*
Ford
Buick
Chevrolet
Chrysler
Dodge
Pontiac

Korean both car companies make crappy affordable cars with good "initial quality" hyundai is the parent company of kia..... imo these cars arent worth your time unless you lease for like 2-3 years or you're REALLY out of money and u want a new car
Kia
Hyundai

i also agree with ^ that guy acuras new cars all look sleek n nice.... well except the 05 rsx, imo it was a downgrade for looks

Euro High End
Bmw - not bad, I actually like the way the 6 series looks
Mercedes Benz - mostly boring except their roadsters
Jaguar - all of their designs look pretty dated because they are
Volvo - new S40 is real nice, hopefully more will look nice
Saab - people don't buy saabs because they're pretty, but the 9-5 Aero isn't horrible looking
Audi - design seems to move slowly over there

Japan High End
Acura (Honda) - boring and formulaic
Lexus (Toyota) - needs some new models, the IS300 is OLD
Infiniti (Nissan) - like the new SUV's and G35, more should look like that

US High End
Cadillac - Love the new look, the XLR is flat out mean looking
Lincoln - Needs some new designs, something somewhat fun looking

European
Mini (Bmw) - Funky but not bad
Volkswagen - whens the last time they redesigned anything?

Japanesse
Honda - boring except for S2000
Toyota - even more boring, but at least they look more substantial than comparable hondas
Nissan - Like everything about them except the taillights on the Altima
Subaru - nice, but why does everything have to look like a rally car? The SVX was really nice, I bet they could do something like that again if they put their minds to it.
Mitsubishi - Tacky Tacky Tacky, as close as you can get to factory rice
Isuzu - random assortment of uncompetetive odd looking SUV's
Mazda - like the 6 and 3 alot, Miata still impresses
Scion - Xa and Xb are 2 of the ugliest cars ever made, Tc is cool because its new, I bet it'll get boring though
Suzuki - Aero SX isn't bad, everything else is an appliance

U.S
Ford - new direction is very good, new Mustang looks great
Buick - why did they get rid of Oldsmobile, who actually made some decent looking cars, and leave us with this crap instead?
Chevrolet - corvette is really good, cobalt is alright, malibu and trucks still very boring
Chrysler - definitely improved, has some moxy now
Dodge - Magnum full of moxy, SRT4 is really cool in person
Pontiac - GTO too boring, but its also kinda a good thing, its not really supposed to stand out too much. new GP isn't really an improvement over the old one. new G6 isn't very impressive either.

Korean
Kia - incredibly boring
Hyundai - Tib is kinda ricey, everything else extremely boring, why do they need to make 2 apparently similar SUV's?

I don't feel like listing my opinion on every manufacturer's styling, but I'd have to say that my favorite right now is Subaru. The WRX STi is the coolest looking car I've ever seen, and the Legacy plays the role of a more mature WRX extremely well. Even the Outback and Forester look cool compared to most compact SUVs, especially in turbo form.

Euro High End
Bmw: at least you dont have to buy one for spare parts anymore
Mercedes Benz: starting to look boring but they make up for it in greatness
Jaguar: style is dated but i still love it (also comments about bmw apply)
Volvo: when i have a family i will buy one.
Sabb: boring
Audi: i like them but ill just buy a vw.

Japan High End
Acura (Honda) im liking the new acuras.
Lexus (Toyota) Very Bland
Infiniti (Nissan) Ahhh, finally a GOOD japanese company, great styling and attitude.

US High End
Cadillac: i like the oldies (nothing like a 24 foot car)
Lincoln: i love lincolns, they look great but performance is lacking.

European
Mini (Bmw) hmmm...
Volkswagen: see comments about audi

Japanesse
Honda: "The Vtecs Kicking In!" my torque kicked in about 5 minutes ago.
Toyota: poor yota, must be on the drugs.
Nissan: see infiniti comments
Subaru: i love subarus but they need more performance, less wagon.
Mitsubishi: not worth my time
Kia: great car for college kids.
Isuzu: pretty nice suv's
Hyundai: see kia comments
Mazda: ok, mazda is my personal favorite import company, they look so frickin good its scary, unfortunately performance is not on par... YET!
Scion: better styling than toyota but no.
Suzuki: never even had a chance did they? :( nice bikes though

U.S
Ford: Seriously? Read the name. seriously though, im very happy with the direction theyre going and the new mustang is a dream come true.
Buick: my first car was an 86 lesabre limited 2 door. very comfortable.
Chevrolet: classics are awesome, only new chevy's i like are the vette and the cobalt.
Chrysler: theyre a great average car company.
Dodge: they built a 300 MPH motorcycle... nuff' said.
Pontiac: agressive styling only goes so far.

i dont know what every single car looks like in each company, but i ll do my best. yes or no based on what ive seen.

Euro High End
Bmw-yes
Mercedes Benz-yes
Jaguar-its ok
Volvo-yes
Sabb-yes
Audi-yes

Japan High End
Acura (Honda)-yes
Lexus (Toyota)-yes
Infiniti (Nissan)-yes

US High End
Cadillac-its ok
Lincoln-no, only the ls is ok looking.

European
Mini (Bmw)-yes, i like its unique style.
Volkswagen-yes

Japanesse
Honda-yes
Toyota-no on their cars, only trucks, and suvs look good to me.
Nissan-yes, except the sentra is ok looking.
Subaru-yes
Mitsubishi-yes
Kia-no
Isuzu-no
Hyundai-no, only the tiburon looks ok.
Mazda-yes
Scion-its ok
Suzuki-no

U.S
Ford-its ok, only the new mustang looks good.
Buick-big no
Chevrolet-its ok, only the c6 looks good.
Chrysler-no, only the crossfire looks good.
Dodge-its ok, only the srt-4, and the viper looks good.
Pontiac-no, only the gto, and the g6 looks ok.

Euro High End
Bmw - "magazines and enthusiasts will like what I tell them to like" - Chris Bangle
Mercedes Benz - upper end models look nice, lower ones look uninspired
Jaguar - no comment
Volvo - come a long way from those stupid ugly wagons... I like their progress
Saab - I can't sell cars so let me steal Subarus
Audi - sleek designs throughout the lineup

Japan High End
Acura - revitalized models, look spohisticated...sorta needs a V-8
Lexus - zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Infiniti - beautiful designs, well engineered, if only I could afford a G35

US High End
Cadillac - accomplished amazing designs to attract younger buyers
Lincoln - yeahhhh no...

European
Mini (Bmw) - nothing really to say
Volkswagen - average styling, nothing to turn heads

Japanesse/Oriental
Honda - boring styled linup (except S2000) but meant to be that way
Toyota - zzzzzz cancel Mr2 and Celica zzzzzzz bring back ugly supra zzz
Nissan - decent styling, world class V-6 used in everything
Subaru - beautiful vehicles, driving inspiration
Mitsubishi - plain, underpowered (exceptEvo)
Kia - thanks for coming out
Isuzu - goodbye
Hyundai - you get what you pay for...look at me I have a Tiburon, its a sports car
Mazda - new cars look fantastic, when will ford steal their designs?
Scion - ok i guess
Suzuki - stick to bikes

U.S
Ford - mustang looks gorgeous...thats about it
Buick - you suck!
Chevrolet - cobalt is nice, tough trucks and SUV's
Chrysler - 300 is nice...Pacifica isnt...overall improving styling
Dodge - can't wait for the charger, improving as well
Pontiac - no effort into GTO (sales show this), G6 and solstice look nice

Hyundai - you get what you pay for...look at me I have a Tiburon, its a sports car!

---------------------------------------------------------------------

True. Lol :grinno: :rofl:

Euro High End
Bmw-I'm not a big fan of the way the headlights are shaped now, but otherwise they look fantastic.
Mercedes Benz-I love the way MB's look right now.
Jaguar-Always loved the way Jags look.
Volvo-I like the looks of the 850's when they were around, but now with the rounded edges I'm not liking the styling as much anymore.
Sabb-Never really liked the Saabs...I think they look kinda funny.
Audi-They have that classy yet very sporty look to them that I really like.

Japan High End
Acura (Honda)-I like the NSX's looks but the rest of the lineup is a little boring to me...nice looking but boring
Lexus (Toyota)-Love the IS300 and the SUV's other than that...
Infiniti (Nissan)-That G35 looks great!!!

US High End
Cadillac-Love the whole lineup
Lincoln-...

European
Mini (Bmw)-Not a big fan of the way the Mini looks but I do like the car.
Volkswagen-Good cars but Fugly.

Japanesse/Oriental
Honda-Love the S2000 but the rest of the lineup just plain sucks.
Toyota-Boring!!!
Nissan-Fresh new designs and the 350Z is one of my favorite cars.
Subaru-Starting to be a little less Fugly with the new Legacy, but I've always loved the looks of the WRX, esspecially the STi.
Mitsubishi-I think the Evo looks downright awesome, but the rest of the lineup needs to look a little more aggressive.
Kia-Fugly
Isuzu-Fugly
Hyundai-I think the Tiburon looks decent.
Mazda-The Mazda3 and 6 look great!!!
Scion-The xA sucks, the Xb sucks but is almost creative, and the tC looks and handles amazing for it's price.
Suzuki-no comment.

U.S
Ford-I like Ford bringing back the looks from the past with the new Mustang and GT they both look amazing. The rest of the lineup seems a little dated to me.
Buick-Never really liked anthing Buick made except for the GN's.
Chevrolet-The C6 is starting to grow on me as far as looks, but I've never thought a Chevy within the last 10 years or so was all that good looking, I liked them because of the LS1's and LT1's.
Chrysler-Love the 300C but not the rest of the lineup.
Dodge-The Viper and Magnum kick ass!!!
Pontiac-Some people don't like the GTO and I don't think that I do, but when ever I see one I catch myself staring at it for a long time.

Euro High End
Bmw: Except for the new 6-Series Bangle has been a disaster. The 5 and 7 look horrible, and the 6 is not gorgeous, just "attractive". The 3-Series still looks great, possibly because Bangle has not had his way with it yet.

Mercedes Benz: Very good looking in their current form except for the new Pinochio noses on some of the roadsters. Those look awful.

Jaguar: Mostly gorgeous cars that could stand to change a bit more over time if anything. Only sore spot is the X-Type...looks like the wannabe car it is.

Volvo: Much improved, with the S60R a real looker. Still needs more style in the S80.

Saab: The new 9 is pretty but invisible. The WRX looks better as a Saab ;)

Audi: These cars looked like they belonged in a Museum until some dil-weed put the huge grille on them..shame.

Japan High End
Acura: The whole line is attractive now. The RL does not look it's price tag though, and neither does the RSX. The NSX concept would likely have been the best looking Honda ever, and they axed it??

Lexus: The LS430 looks exactly as it should, even if it is not my kind of car. Trucks look very good and the IS is alright. GS sucks and the ES is as invisible as the Camry it is based on.

Infiniti: Whoever did the new full size SUV should be shot. It makes Bangles stuff look good. the G35 is very nice, but the Q45 still cannot figure out what it should be. Outoing M45 looks like a 4-door rendition of a Grand National...boxy but fast.

US High End
Cadillac: I do not car for the new look, although it is working for them. The look works best on the XLR which is attractive.

Lincoln: The soon to debut Zephyr looks good, but as all other Lincolns in no way appeals to anyone wanting performance. Navigator looks much better than Escalade IMHO

European
Mini (Bmw): BMW hit this one on the head

Volkswagen: Nice looking cars that are held back by their ridiculous price tags. Golf/Jetta is much better looking than any Japanese competitor.

Japanesse/Oriental
Honda: Never been a car company known for making a lot of lookers. Accord is better than Camry IMHO, Civic is boring, and the S2000 looks like a Civic turned roadster. Accord Coupe is the best looking Honda.

Toyota: If you cannot count sheep count Toyotas..just as likely to put you to sleep. Solara is the only Toyota car I would call pretty, and it is a girl car all the way. Truck line is handsome, but it would be nice if they came up with their own fullsize look instead of rehashing a Ford

Nissan: The Sentra is suprisingly okay for a Japanese econo car, and the Altima is actually attractive. Maxima is awful and the 350Z does nothing for me....G35 coupe is much more attractive. The new trucks are horrible except for the very nice new Pathfinder.

Subaru: Legacy may be best looking mid-size sedan. Imprezza is not attractive even without the goggles. Forester is just stupid.

Mitsubishi: New front end design for sedans is not cutting it. Eclipse is okay, but needs to lose the ribbed cladding it aped from Pontiac. Evo is better looking than WRX although that is not saying much. Montero is good looking but over-priced and now...gone. Outlander need to be shipped somehwere out of this land...heinous

Kia: Kia took notes from Toyota

Isuzu: Invisible and weird..hard combo to attain

Hyundai: Tiburon is very, very nice looking for its class. XG is not bad either.

Scion: Toyota did what they do best...copied somebody. The new coupe is good looking, but only because it looks like a Volvo. The other stuff is just weird

Suzuki: Okay looking cars, better than Toyota looks wise and equal with Honda.

U.S
Ford: Mustang looks fantastic, and GT is a jaw dropper. Pickups are good looking, but SUV's are a bit bland. Sedan lineup is getting better but still so-so and bland. 500 is promising

Buick: Like everything bad from the 50's in an aero design.

Chevrolet: A rental car for everyone. Makes Honda look inspired with the exception of the very good looking C6 Vette and decent Cobalt. SUV's look good, but pickups have a weird variation the same front end.

Chrysler: Crossfire looks good but people unfortunately do not fit. 300 is unique and very Chrysler. Everything else sucks

Dodge; Pickups look good but are cheaply designed. Viper is rapidly becoming a charicature of itself, and the new Durango is horrible. Magnum RT sucks too

Pontiac: new GTO is okay, but looks like a rwd grand Prix. All the other new stuff looks like the old stuff without the ground effects...not good.

"Mazda - new cars look fantastic, when will ford steal their designs?"

what maes you say that? if ford were in the market of stealing designs they woulda replaced the taurus with a sleeker looking car (ford 500) o... wait... ya, nevermind but honestly ford wont steal theyre designs (technically they own those designs anyways.), fords are lookin so much better they have no need to (i love how mazdas look but the stang is art)

The 500 is not a Taurus replacement; the Ford Fuzion is. The 500 is just a big-ass traditional American sedan, only without the V8 power or the RWD. :/

Ford is changing al big portion of its lineup for this year...see how it goes...

C&D said ford would be making their own rebandaged Mazda 6, plus the new 2L and 2.3L are mazda engines, plus the 500 is based on the volvo platform...but enough about that I really dont care, all I am saying is that Mazdas new cars are being credited with innovative styling, while the 500's styling was called uninspired, and I wouldnt call the taurus a head-turner...but I have to admit, the new mustang looks beautiful

C&D said ford would be making their own rebandaged Mazda 6, plus the new 2L and 2.3L are mazda engines, plus the 500 is based on the volvo platform...but enough about that I really dont care, all I am saying is that Mazdas new cars are being credited with innovative styling, while the 500's styling was called uninspired, and I wouldnt call the taurus a head-turner...but I have to admit, the new mustang looks beautiful


What I do not get is how so many people do not get that Mazda is run by Ford now.....period. And, I do not mean this as a flame, because the vast majority of folks seem to hold that very mindset.

This would be good new as far as Fo Mo Co is concerned as this is exactly the idea they want to project. As a matter of fact Ford intentionally under-states the controlling presence they have at Mazda in an effort to not upset the "faithful". (I never understood that as the Mazda faithful is an unfortunately small group)

How do I know this? Several ways .

First, I used to work for a tier-1 auto supplier and we would get visits from corporate big-wigs checking on their "stuff" from time to time. "Mazda guys" (engineers, stylists, product analysts, etc.) walked in wearing Ford shirts as often if not more often than Mazda shirts.

And before you dismiss that I asked, on more than one occasion, "are you not technically a Mazda employee". The answer was always something like "yes, but I transferred here from Ford", or "it is a temporary assignment I normally do Fords"...pick an explanation.

These were Ford guys, a lot of them, doing Mazda's. Mazda has "dedicated personnel, just as Mercury and Lincoln do. But, if you work for Mazda you really work for Ford, plain and simple.

The second reason is, Ford claims control of Mazda, and Mazda as part of their franchise on their corporate site and in press releases. If this is untrue apparently neither Ford, the Japanese governement, or Mazda has caught it yet. Too many people think Ford share of Mazda is not large enough to constitue ownership, but they own the majority stake and that means exactly what it sounds like. They run the show.

When Ford says "Mazda 6 platform", understand this is nothing more than a corporate platform. Mazda engineers are Ford engineers and this is just another Ford platform. And, in the same way Mazda styling is simply the particular style used by one of Ford's brands. Ford owns it, Ford developed it.

The fact that an engineer gets a Mazda paycheck and works in a Mazda office makes little difference when it is Ford's pen writing the check and Ford big-wigs running the show.

I would prefer Ford leave Mazda styling to that brand. It would be a mistake to do so, and Ford really does need to keep these companies more "seperate" than they do now. (I hate the extensive sharing of platforms...Mazda really is becoming a Japanese Ford with a sporty bend) But saying Ford could "steal" styling from Mazda is like saying Ford could steal styling from Lincoln.

syr74, yea ford pretty much owns it, but the engineering involves all the companies. the rx-8 is really mazdas engineering, since it was done in japan, and the engine in the volvo s40 is actually volvo engineering, so even though ford pretty much owns it, there are things that are still their own.

"Mazda - new cars look fantastic, when will ford steal their designs?"

what maes you say that? if ford were in the market of stealing designs they woulda replaced the taurus with a sleeker looking car (ford 500) o... wait... ya, nevermind but honestly ford wont steal theyre designs (technically they own those designs anyways.), fords are lookin so much better they have no need to (i love how mazdas look but the stang is art)

mazda is owned by ford in the us, so no stealing will be necessary, instead.. use the word... "borrowing" heh

Euro High End
Bmw-M5 is hot, the rest suck
Mercedes Benz-No, go away you overpriced POS
Jaguar-How disgusting
Volvo-You safe liberal POC
Sabb- its SAAB we used to have a 93, it was sweet
Audi-I like the RS6 and Rs4, plus the W12 A8 is hot

Japan High End
Acura (Honda)-Gross, its a Honda
Lexus (Toyota)-boring piece of crap
Infiniti (Nissan)-We have a g35 ITS AMAZING, the SUVs are hot, the sedans are hot.

US High End
Cadillac-I like the new Caddys
Lincoln-eww, you should be shot

European
Mini (Bmw)-I wanted one, WHEN I WAS 12
Volkswagen-AH!!! ITS THE NAZIS'!!!!!!

Japanesse/Oriental
Honda-Worst car maker ever. Go away.
Toyota-The Avalon and Land Crusier are ok. The rest suck.
Nissan-The Best Car Maker out there. i lvoe my Nissans! *huggles them*
Subaru-Sisters BF has an STI, ITS CRAZY FAST!. Legacys are hot
Mitsubishi-Eww, gross, no
Kia-You get what you pay for i suppose.
Isuzu-Your going to run out of buisiness.
Hyundai-Nasty. I just took a Hundai in the toilet.
Mazda-I REALLY like the RX-8
Scion-Gross, go back to Japans ass.
Suzuki-Stick with making the bikes.

U.S
Ford-Never was a Ford Guy.
Buick-OLD PEOPLE!! EWW I CAN SMELL THEM VOER HERE!
Chevrolet-We have two Chevys, a Silverado (sweet) and the Trailblazer (needs a V8)
Chrysler-Ultimate Trophey Mom Van! The Chrysler TOwn a Country Limited =O
Dodge-The Charger and Magnum are sweet.
Pontiac-I do like the new G6