Pontiac GTO TO Drift In Formula D

http://www.drifting.com/article.php?threadid=2003&goto=newpost&show_Title=

I'm stoked as shit. The GTO is a great car, Rhys Millen a great driver, and this will show everyone that its not all about JDM

Definitely a good sign for the health of the SCCA's Formula D. And if the GTO smacks around a few S13's and Hachi-Rokus, all the better.

Here's to drift diversity! Here's to thinking outside the box! :cheers:

last week did you see the episode of RIDES on TLC had Millen's old man putting a 4.3l v8 in a is300 for drifting SWEEEETTT and ashort section ab drifting prob a re-run though

once again.... Formula D????

After the success of the US D1 Gran Prix, and the fact that their upstart rival the NASA sanctions the US Drift amateur competitions at their Hyperfest gatherings, the SCCA announced this year their sanctioning of the first American based professional drift circuit, called Formula D, or alternatively Formula Drift.

It's the real deal, as you can see. No posers, just a good way to weed out the men from the boys.

After the success of the US D1 Gran Prix, and the fact that their upstart rival the NASA sanctions the US Drift amateur competitions at their Hyperfest gatherings, the SCCA announced this year their sanctioning of the first American based professional drift circuit, called Formula D, or alternatively Formula Drift.

It's the real deal, as you can see. No posers, just a good way to weed out the men from the boys.

Formula D is weak. Only sponsored drivers will be able to compete.

That IS300 was pretty pimp, but Id rather have a 2JZ, or better yet, a 3SGE..imagine the weight reduction from a 4cyl.!

Octagon-Im freakin psyched. I cannot wait to see all the S13 and AE86 fanboys shit themselves when a dreaded domestic choku dori's by them at 90mph!

its cool that they are putting USDM stuff out there now, but abotu the V8 drift car, WHY!?!? that engine will be so heavy and horrid for drifting, in drifting you need the engine to be smooth a V8 is anything but smooth, plus you don't need that much power to drift so I don't see why its exciting to see, I'm willing to bet that it will suck balls as a drift car, V8s are too heavy and rough, thats basically anti-drift if you ask me...

Rough? The LS1 will rev clear up to 7000rpm without skipping a beat. It only weighs in at around 390lbs, turn key (not bad for a 5.7L engine of any configuration) and delivers gobs of torque and power. A Toyota 2JZ-GTE (like in the Toyota Soarer or Supra) weighs in at 478lbs turn-key.

I won't deny that the LS1 in the GTO isn't as light as, say, a 13B or an SR20DET, after all we are talking about a 5.7L V8. But it's a smooth, capable, and tractable engine in a superbly competent chassis.

My take on it is that if you get a kick out of seeing Soarers and Chasers drift, you're going to love seeing (and hearing) the GTO.

Yeah it'll sound pretty mean and make alought of smoke, but isnt it a little heavy? I mean it weighs 3770ILBS. But I gues they could do what Ueno did to his Soarer. Its gotta be tough keeping that long wheelbase soarer sideways without just spinning.

Um, Long wheelbase is much more stable in a four wheel drift.

have your driven a big v8 motored car?
what makes you think it's so rough?

typical import owner's opinion of a domestic motor.

i'm glad that someone is finally realizing that you don't need a japanese car to drift.

domestics can, and do, drift just as well as imports.

weight?
what about the 4 door r34 skyline that's out there...
and the soarer that's been mentioned.
you don't think that millen would strip the car to get weight down? it's not that hard, those seats have to weight at least 60 lbs. each for the fronts...

Not only does this car have the advatage of dis-spelling any notions about domestics being inferior, but it will have the advatage of making ricers/fanboys think that drifting has sold out and is lame, which will make them turn away in disgust :)

Ford, get off your ass and make a 2005 Mustang for Formula D!

I think once the Pontiac Solstice comes out, it will replace the GTO as the Pontiac Drift Mobile.

that, and the solstice should be a 4 cylinder...
it could be marketed to the import kids...
and it's an awesome looking car...

bwahaha...all the rice boys are probably gonna get their pantys in a knot just reading about this. Hell, this might even change my outlook on drifting. (read sig :))

Yeah but there is a problem for the 2005 mustang. I just realized it last night. I was reading, and they are downgrading from the last one (in some ways). It is going to use a solid rear axel! I cant believe it, they say that they use it because it will be cheaper and better for drag racing. But I mean doesnt that really limit the car? They also said that it is riding on a "modified" Jaguar/Lincoln LS frame. But that could be good, because it may be the all aluminum frame by Jaguar? Does anyone know? But it couldent be because they made the 4.6L 70ILBS lighter than the old 4.6L and with that aluminum frame, it couldent still weigh 3450ILBS. But hey, I think this is a great thing for Ford, because people are gonna be all over the cars in fall (especialy with the pretty low price) and Ford has been kinda struggling, so it'll be great for the economy.

bwahaha...all the rice boys are probably gonna get their pantys in a knot just reading about this. Hell, this might even change my outlook on drifting. (read sig :))

So your talking about this right (See below)


Yeah but there is a problem for the 2005 mustang. I just realized it last night. I was reading, and they are downgrading from the last one (in some ways). It is going to use a solid rear axel! I cant believe it, they say that they use it because it will be cheaper and better for drag racing. But I mean doesnt that really limit the car? They also said that it is riding on a "modified" Jaguar/Lincoln LS frame. But that could be good, because it may be the all aluminum frame by Jaguar? Does anyone know? But it couldent be because they made the 4.6L 70ILBS lighter than the old 4.6L and with that aluminum frame, it couldent still weigh 3450ILBS. But hey, I think this is a great thing for Ford, because people are gonna be all over the cars in fall (especialy with the pretty low price) and Ford has been kinda struggling, so it'll be great for the economy.

Yeah, so, the AE86 uses the solid rear axle. Doesnt stop it from getting sideways. All mustangs except the 1999+ Cobras have used a sold rear axle, its not a big deal. In fact, its great because when your diff breaks(which will happen), it will be loads easier to change it.

Actully, the solid rear axel will make it easier to kick sideways, because it will be more solid. But once it is sideways it will be harder to maintain the drift without spinning out. Also the drift will have more friction, resulting in slower speed.

When you have a 320hp V8, speed isnt an issue, and its got a nice sized wheelbase.

Unfortunately when you're sideways that 320hp is useless. The car is extremely heavy and that's going to slow it down considerably in a drift.

Actully, the solid rear axel will make it easier to kick sideways, because it will be more solid. But once it is sideways it will be harder to maintain the drift without spinning out. Also the drift will have more friction, resulting in slower speed.


So you're gonna say that to all the guys who drift the AE86?

Haha, I like how you're all calling the Pontiac GTO a "Domestic" or "USDM"... its as much an import as any euro or jap car.
I'm here to tell you that car is AUSTRALIAN MADE (though we import the LS1) ! thats right folks its an "AUSDM import"....
Made by Holden Motors, a subsidiary of GM. And as I said, imported from the other side of the world.
In Australia its badged Holden Monaro, and looks a little different - like this :
http://www.tuned-belgium.com/modules/Uploads/Uploads/Dub/TB28.jpg

I wonder if "AUSDM" will be the new big thing...

I am Australian, by the way, if you hadn't guessed...

Yeah, We know it's from Australia... old news.

well, there IS about three posts in the thread calling it "USDM" and "Domestic" so perhaps some people aren't quite as up with the "news" as we are...

Yeah, my dad almost got one of those, didnt they finally get released this fall. He had a $300 dollar order thing on it, but then this 1969 Cutlass convertible with a 442 4 speed showed up, (Drums all around :lol2:) So he took the order off. I heard that they are coming out with a 4WD Manaro. I wonder if that will carry over to the GTOs.

um, yeah.
it's going to be sold in the US as a USDM car.
it's a USDM car. doesn't matter where it's from.

my prelude isn't really a JDM car, b/c it was sold here and bought here.

dorikin beat me to it.
ae86 is rwd, live axle.
no issues? right?

so what's wrong with a live axle car, such as a mustang, drifting?

some people make no sense.

Haha, I like how you're all calling the Pontiac GTO a "Domestic" or "USDM"... its as much an import as any euro or jap car.
I'm here to tell you that car is AUSTRALIAN MADE (though we import the LS1) ! thats right folks its an "AUSDM import"....
Made by Holden Motors, a subsidiary of GM. And as I said, imported from the other side of the world.
In Australia its badged Holden Monaro, and looks a little different - like this :
http://www.tuned-belgium.com/modules/Uploads/Uploads/Dub/TB28.jpg

I wonder if "AUSDM" will be the new big thing...

I am Australian, by the way, if you hadn't guessed...

I like the Monaro front alot better than the GTO..if only GM would bring the Commodore with the LS1 over here..

That car sux..... I'm gonna wait for the NEW (actual) GTR R35 COMING TO THE USA IN 2007!!!!!! Nissan's Pres just announced it!!!!!

yeah, hold your breath...
but call 91- before you do that...

it's been announced that we'll get a gtr (the new one) for quite a long time now...

Think about it, its basic. The live axel will break free more easily, but once its drifting, it wont give you as much control.

That car sux..... I'm gonna wait for the NEW (actual) GTR R35 COMING TO THE USA IN 2007!!!!!! Nissan's Pres just announced it!!!!!

You suck..Im gonna wait for a new person(actually knowing something) to make an intelligent comment about drifting..that will happen in 2007!

I like the Monaro front alot better than the GTO..if only GM would bring the Commodore with the LS1 over here..

Wait and see what happens if the free trade agreement with Australia goes through....you might be surprised...

Wait and see what happens if the free trade agreement with Australia goes through....you might be surprised...

remeber what happened when the simpsons went to australia?

They came back home with a koala that could have possibly destroyed our environmnt...

Australia sux... and has nothing to do with drifting, mate! So does this thread! Sux B@lls! :thefinger

remeber what happened when the simpsons went to australia?

They came back home with a koala that could have possibly destroyed our environmnt...

Your'e right, kid! Nothing good ever came out of Australia! Foster's Beer, Croc Hunter, Men at Work... the new GTO.... all crap! Can't wait for the SKYLINE GTR to arrive to us! Too bad the Aussie's have the SKYLINE's DOWN-UNDER! What was Nissan thinking? Can you picture a drunken Aussie cruising in a GTR R34 with a stuffed Croc strapped to the hood? Horrid!
Anyhow... back to drifting! The GTO is not gonna lay the LAW down in D1GP! Rhys is gonna get spanked like he did last year! He was better off in the Supra! I can not wait to see the REVOLVER AE86 and all the S13's leave the GTO in a cloud of tire smoke! Domestics/V8's are Prehistoric! Get with times!

this will be good for the drifting community. can't wait til that GTO hits the track

Your'e right, kid! Nothing good ever came out of Australia! Foster's Beer, Croc Hunter, Men at Work... the new GTO.... all crap! Can't wait for the SKYLINE GTR to arrive to us! Too bad the Aussie's have the SKYLINE's DOWN-UNDER! What was Nissan thinking? Can you picture a drunken Aussie cruising in a GTR R34 with a stuffed Croc strapped to the hood? Horrid!
Anyhow... back to drifting! The GTO is not gonna lay the LAW down in D1GP! Rhys is gonna get spanked like he did last year! He was better off in the Supra! I can not wait to see the REVOLVER AE86 and all the S13's leave the GTO in a cloud of tire smoke! Domestics/V8's are Prehistoric! Get with times!


You sir, are the most ignorant non-sensical moron I have seen in ages. There are an unbelivable number of nice Skylines down under, including 2 my online friend Meggala owns, not to mention Taranakis(even though thats NZ, same continent). By the way, resorting to petty racism just proves how your a pubeless 10 year old whos knowledge of drifting is limited to Initial D.

Rhys is going to wipe the floor, and little wannabe shits like you are gonna be first. He wasnt better off with the Supra. It weighs more stock, the engine ways a bit less stock, makes less power and torque, and isnt engineered for the same driving as the Monaro/GTO is. The Monaro/GTO is made for gravel roads that are prevalent in Australia, so there is a fair bit of oversteer dialed in at the limit.

The REVOLVER AE86. Gimme a break. Ueo won because they didnt want you Takumi wannabes to riot and trash the place(even though you guys did, and jacked tons of stuff..sahme on you)

Your Domestic generalization is false.

The GTO has an all alloy V8, 6 speed gearbox, 2 way LSD, all aluminum independent suspension and alloy wheels.

Now lets look at the Hachi. Live axle, steel wheels, open diff, carbs(on some models).

Its people like you who will hold drifting back, by prepetuating these petty rivalries. Put down Super Street. A good car is a good car. Nomuken shit himself over Bob Bondurants Crown Vics and Mustang. You may hate the domestics, but these guys LOOOVE them.

Its people like you who will pull dumb shit, like street drift and ruin it for all.

I'm with jdmkenji. This will do wonders for drifting. Lets see its performance. Bring it on.

Actually Dorikin, like I said on page one, a turn key crate LS1 weighs in at 390lbs, while a turn key crate 2JZ weighs in at 478lbs.

Hmm, quick math.....

The big 5.7L American V8 weighs 88lbs less than the 3.0L Japanese straight six.

And, 1via, in case you haven't noticed THIS ISN'T THE FUCKING D1GP! This is the SCCA's Formula Drift series! It's a stateside PROFESSIONAL drift series promoted by the people who brought D1 to the states and sanctioned by America's oldest auto racing club.

No one is out and out saying the new GTO is going to be the dominant car, either. They're saying it'll be cool to see one drift and it's good that a USDM manufacturer wants to support our hobby.

Oh yeah, quick question. Do you think AC/DC sucks? They're Australian. How about Denny Hulme? Or Mark Webber?

God, such a twit.

There are cars far heavier than the GTO... and they all can be drifted... look at the soarer, the supra, the 4door skyline....

by the time RMR is done modifying the GTO it will be one very competetive and driftable machine.

Some people are too shallow to see the possibilities. Weight can all be remedied with suspension and weight reduction tuning.

Actually Dorikin, like I said on page one, a turn key crate LS1 weighs in at 390lbs, while a turn key crate 2JZ weighs in at 478lbs.

Hmm, quick math.....

The big 5.7L American V8 weighs 88lbs less than the 3.0L Japanese straight six.

And, 1via, in case you haven't noticed THIS ISN'T THE FUCKING D1GP! This is the SCCA's Formula Drift series! It's a stateside PROFESSIONAL drift series promoted by the people who brought D1 to the states and sanctioned by America's oldest auto racing club.

No one is out and out saying the new GTO is going to be the dominant car, either. They're saying it'll be cool to see one drift and it's good that a USDM manufacturer wants to support our hobby.

Oh yeah, quick question. Do you think AC/DC sucks? They're Australian. How about Denny Hulme? Or Mark Webber?

God, such a twit.

My bad. After I made the post, but buddy told me his figures werw wrong(he reversed them). Too lazy to edit. Not that I care, these peoples minds are too closed.

Oh, Formula D is actually being used to find American competitors for D1. Its not official, but its the word on the street. So, if Rhys Millen makes D1, then Ill jump for joy when all these ricers turn away in disgust. On the other hand, baised judging could hamped that.

AC/DC ownz, I saw them live



There are cars far heavier than the GTO... and they all can be drifted... look at the soarer, the supra, the 4door skyline....

by the time RMR is done modifying the GTO it will be one very competetive and driftable machine.

Some people are too shallow to see the possibilities. Weight can all be remedied with suspension and weight reduction tuning.


Considering what RMR can do, expect some crazy stuff. Im thinking a gutted interior, CF parts, full coilover suspension, Corvette spec Goodyear Eagles, Z06 Brakes, Z06 engine parts(intake manifold maybe), Borla mufflers. This is gonna be one badass car.

It's alright... there will always be suspension upgrades and modification that will allow you to use the car for whatever kind of sport you want...

I can't wait for this, when is it supposed to all acctually happen and will this formula d or whatever be on cable or anything? I don't freakin care whoes in it, I just wanna watch some drifting on tv! I mean Nascar is on every sunday for over half the year and you don't see people jumpin that bandwagon... once drifting is on tv and isn't the new fad, we won't have as many posers...

whats wrong with street drifting? where am I supposed to drift? you gonna rent out a track for me? or better yet build one that is somewhere near me so you can rent it out to me for the weekend! don't tell people not to drift on the street, you think all the D1 guys learned on tracks? please! you know they were down in parking lots, back roads, wherever they could go that had open roads or even just concrete, its all about being smart... don't go drifting around a corner down town or anything, just be smart and you'll be alright.... oh and wear your seatbelt :)

1via.... your stupid, why do you hate Australia? you been there? spent time there meeting people and learning the customs and all that? then how can you hate them?

why do so many Americans have to go about thinking we are all high and mighty cuz we're Americans, kidn of like how George Bush thinks its ok to destroy Iraq looking for weapons of mass destruction because he thinks they have them, then finds out they don't, and decides to "restore" Iraq... our country is so screwed up and the govt. is worthless and dumb so I don't know how you could talk trash on australia... how many wars has australia been in? I can't think of any, sounds like a good place to me... now stop acting like America is better than every other country, our system is horrid, its no wonder nobody wants to adopt our style of govt... anyways enough of my rant

Australia sux... and has nothing to do with drifting, mate! So does this thread! Sux B@lls! :thefinger

erm, 1viadrift,

http://www.fulllock.com
http://www.japanesemotorsport.com
http://www.d1garage.com

Have a look at those AUSSIE sites and tell me we have nothing to do with drifting.....We have drifting comps and loyal followers in most states, and this year a national series. Our first organised circuit drift comps, if your interested, were in the late 90's - somewhat before it became a "fashionably alternative" hobby in the USA.
Our peak governing body for motorsport , CAMS, has also sanctioned the sport. ....
Download some of the fulllock.com and JMS vids (especially the green R31 coupe... :biggrin: ) and then think about what you said...


Also, I was simply adding a minor point of correction in that its an aussie car, not USA made or what have you, but AUSTRALIAN. Since the thread IS about the GTO, then how could that not be pertinent when its misnamed as a US domestic?

1viadrift, you are a clown, nay an assclown.

somebody get some water, put out the flames!

On a related note, i think that the new GTO is a nice looking and performing car, but to call it a gto is blasphemy. Imean, the name GTO, even though its originally used on a ferrari, gives of the sense of muscle, raw toruqe and power that the styling does not show. does anyone agree with me?

oh yeah and japanese motorsport's site is

http://www.japanesemotorsport.com.au

Ahem... I'm not racist. I'm predjudice! Yes, I've been to Australia... I was bored for two weeks! I never said that the GTR's were not nice down-under... I was merely stating that AUSTRALIA (of all places got them) and not us! When I stated that "Australia has nothing to do with drifting"... I meant: nothing to do with the topic of DRIFTING. No, I'm not ten years old... double that x2 and add 3, please. No, my knowledge of drifting is NOT limited to InitialD... I have probably been into drifting and actually tried it way before some of you POSERS even thought it was "cool".

The drifters in D1 are not ricers nor am I (by far unlike some of you out there who have neon lights under your car!). No I do not "Street-Drift" and I will not be the one to ruin "it" for you guys! No I do not own a 86 "Hachi" (I own a Z32)... but it's a proven fact that these little cars along with S13's dominate drifting! YES (Layla), I'm aware of Formula D... but RHYS MILLEN is still going to compete in D1GP this year in the GTO and that was what I was referring to! Yes, AC/DC sucks along with the others you mentioned! I'm more of a classical man, myself.

Sorry if I offended anyone... that's just the competitive side of me! I wasn't aware you all were so sensitive... please accept my apology.

However, I still think that Rhys is going to get spanked in D1 (cus he is competing in it with his GTO)... I'll be here to say: "I told you so", after it happens! American, Australian, whatever other domestics... are all crap! The GTO is nothing but a STATUS car (much like the Caddillac CTS) with a big powerful motor and some hi-tech junk thrown in to make you "ooh" and "aah".... so what if it has LSD? Is it a good drift car? Probably not as good as an FD, S13, AE86, etc.!

Anyhow... we will see on the 28th if your GTO even gets past the first two eliminations!

And yes........ of all places... I wish I lived in Japan!


Some of the best (affordable) cars ever reside there!

However, I still think that Rhys is going to get spanked in D1 (cus he is competing in it with his GTO)... I'll be here to say: "I told you so", after it happens! American, Australian, whatever other domestics... are all crap! The GTO is nothing but a STATUS car (much like the Caddillac CTS) with a big powerful motor and some hi-tech junk thrown in to make you "ooh" and "aah".... so what if it has LSD? Is it a good drift car? Probably not as good as an FD, S13, AE86, etc.!


I'd say its the driver, and not the car, that gets wins.

it's about freakin time that people realize that you have to be a good driver to drift and win.

to do ANYTHING competitive and win.

look at the ae86 that won the US round of the d1.

compared to the HKS silvia that made 2-3 times the power, far more technologically advanced...

it's driver, not car. (you've got to have a well prepped car, yes, but it's not the ONLY reason)

YES, YES, I agree... when I'm talking about these cars I'm refering to GOOD DRIVERS in general! I totally agree with you that it depends on skill! But what I'm saying is (let me clarify) IF the DRIVERS of a certain equal skill compete in DRIFT... the GTO will suck compared to the other cars is my opinion! Sure it's probably tuned for DRIFT... but c'mon... some cars are better than others... am I right? Of-course! Otherwise we'd all be driving Geo's!

somebody get some water, put out the flames!

oh yeah and japanese motorsport's site is

http://www.japanesemotorsport.com.au

Doh! Thanks for that correction drftk1d, I didn't even realise I'd screwed it up. I knew it was .au, must have left it off in the heat of the moment!

Now, 1viadrft, again you show a real lack of practical knowledge.
Why wouldn't the monaro/GTO be good to drift? it will make similar power and be a similar overall size and layout and weight, to the most popular non S-chassis drift cars, ie soarer, chaser, cefiro,mk11,laurel etc. It has a good suspension setup (though I'm first to admit holdens primitive slightly-modified-datsun trailing arm rear end design leaves something to be desired for grip, it is great for getting sideways - as evidenced by the S-cars..) etc.
I think you should probably shut-the-fvck-up until you have some practical knowledge.

Ahem... I'm not racist. I'm predjudice! Yes, I've been to Australia... I was bored for two weeks! I never said that the GTR's were not nice down-under... I was merely stating that AUSTRALIA (of all places got them) and not us! When I stated that "Australia has nothing to do with drifting"... I meant: nothing to do with the topic of DRIFTING. No, I'm not ten years old... double that x2 and add 3, please. No, my knowledge of drifting is NOT limited to InitialD... I have probably been into drifting and actually tried it way before some of you POSERS even thought it was "cool".

The drifters in D1 are not ricers nor am I (by far unlike some of you out there who have neon lights under your car!). No I do not "Street-Drift" and I will not be the one to ruin "it" for you guys! No I do not own a 86 "Hachi" (I own a Z32)... but it's a proven fact that these little cars along with S13's dominate drifting! YES (Layla), I'm aware of Formula D... but RHYS MILLEN is still going to compete in D1GP this year in the GTO and that was what I was referring to! Yes, AC/DC sucks along with the others you mentioned! I'm more of a classical man, myself.

Sorry if I offended anyone... that's just the competitive side of me! I wasn't aware you all were so sensitive... please accept my apology.

However, I still think that Rhys is going to get spanked in D1 (cus he is competing in it with his GTO)... I'll be here to say: "I told you so", after it happens! American, Australian, whatever other domestics... are all crap! The GTO is nothing but a STATUS car (much like the Caddillac CTS) with a big powerful motor and some hi-tech junk thrown in to make you "ooh" and "aah".... so what if it has LSD? Is it a good drift car? Probably not as good as an FD, S13, AE86, etc.!

Anyhow... we will see on the 28th if your GTO even gets past the first two eliminations!

You are an assclown.

The way you type, your whole vibe that you give off indicates you do not have pubes yet. Your ignorance and total lack of respect for domestics and blindless to the fact they are not dinosaurs just proves my point.

I hope you roll over and die while attempting a choku dori in that fat overweight pig of a Z of yours.

I will not shut-the-fuck-up!
Pubes? Actually I shave mine PORNO style! But why are we talking about my private area?
As I stated... we will see about this GTO... and how it does in D1! It's gonna suck!

Roll over and die? That's bad karma! Good thing I don't drift it, huh sticky dick-lint licker???

DOMESTICS SUCK ASS FOR DRIFTING!

I've never seen any import with a jacobs ladder on their rear suspension to assist in drifting.

Sprint cars have been using them since the 60's.

And, in case you're entirely in the dark, which you've proven time and time again to be, a jacobs ladder is a parallel lever mounted on the right end of the rear axle of a sprint car that lifts the left end of the axle as the right rear suspension compresses, thus making the car naturally perform the "flick" normally done to throw the car into a drift.

Now, show me one example of "superior import drifting" that demonstrates as much creativity and effectiveness as the jacobs ladder.

I've seen Fox-body Mustangs excel in amateur drift events, as well as 3rd gen Camaros. They're good solid platforms for drifting, with HUGE aftermarkets covering every part on the car. You can pick up a catalog and, with bolt-ons, build a Fox 'Stang that produces 350hp, shifts sharper than a rifle's bolt action, can pull 1.2g's on the skid pad, and weighs 500lbs less than stock, and you'll still have enough left in your bank account to paint it in the slickest House of Kolor candies you can imagine.

Now, you mind offering your explanation for why the GTO, or any other common domestic drifting platform (Fox-body Mustang, 3rd or 4th gen Camaro) is a sub-par drift machine? By the way, "because it's a domestic" is not an explanation.

.... Ladies and gentlemen: excuse me if I seem pig-headed, anal or whatever you want to call me! I'm gonna admit I'm a little biased! I see DRIFT, as a motorsport... as a JAPANESE sport... I'm a PURIST when it comes this sport! Already DRIFTING is getting way-too-mainstream for me. I do not like the idea of DOMESTICS in this motorsport and that is the honest truth! I DO NOT LIKE THAT PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO CREATE NEW IDEAS AND BRAND IT AS THERE OWN... because that is exactly what is happening! "Oh this drift thing is really cool! Let me try! Oh, I tried it... now I'm gonna introduce something new to it ('cus I'm a pioneer/or: I want to introduce this new car-platform to all the kids so maybe I can take some sales from the JAPANESE cars) and call the sport my own!!! This is what I do not LIKE and I admit that!

I HAVE OWNED a '65 'Stang, '69 TransAm, '85 TransAm, and an '89 GT Escort... all domestics! I have "dragged-race", "road-raced" these vehicles! I know how domestics handle (not the newer ones I admit)! But (to me) they cannot compare with my now departed 240sx and my newly aquired 300zx! AND I THINK the same in DRIFTING: These CARS will not excel in this sport. I NEVER SAID DOMESTICS CANNOT DRIFT! I'm well aware of the Camaro's competing in some of these drift events... but I'm also aware no DOMESTIC HAS WON ANY DRIFT EVENT! Answer me this: why have these cars not won an event yet???

In closing: I'm not trying to make enemies here. I apologize for saying: AUSTRALIA sucks. MY OPINON ABOUT DOMESTICS IN DRIFTING HAS NOT CHANGE NOR WILL IT... and for this I do not apologize.

Let us just see how the GTO and Rhys will do in D1 with the other Professionals. Ok?

Nice rhetoric, but you didn't answer my question.

Give me one technically founded explanation for why the GTO will not be a good drift car. The following are not answers.

1: The American V8 is heavier than Japanese engines. I've already proven that the LS1 is lighter than a 2JZ-GTE. I'm willing to bet it's also under the weight of an RB26DETT crate motor as well, but it seems that Skyline owners aren't very willing to post the weight of their engines up on the net. As far as the LS1 being heavier than an SR20DET, a 4AGE, or a 13B rotary, we're talking totally different beasts. After all, the LS1 displaces 5.7L, the others displace 2.0L, 1.6L, and 1.3L respectively.

2: It's heavy. So's a Soarer, an R32 GTS Skyline, a four door Skyline, a Chaser, a Cefiro, a Laurel, etc. etc. etc... Not to mention the car obviously won't be left stock. You can do as much with carbon fiber, aluminum, and fiberglass with a domestic as you can with an import.

3: It's not Japanese. So what. Big Deal. Who cares.

And I'll answer your question right now. Drifting has been for many many many years an underground import hobby in the states. Even the majority of the import crowd was unaware of it up until about three or four years ago. The people who have been drifting for some time have been import enthusiasts who have little or no love for drag racing, can't stand the show cars, and wanted to be a little different. They've adopted a very fun past time and, thanks to their enthusiasm, they've made it visible and acceptable as a motorsport on this side of the Pacific.

They call that progress, by the way.

The domestic guys who've got involved generally speaking are guys who were friends of drifters who basically said "Shit that looks like fun." Instead of doing something as dumbassed as running out and buying a new car, they used what they had (remember, run whatcha brung and shoestring budgets are two parts of the drifting mystique). There isn't as much experience in the domestic camp, and most experienced drifters aren't hopping into Camaros and Mustangs because that isn't what they learned in. The cars react differently and, as with all things, drifting skills take time and effort to master. I do not doubt that within three years we will see a Fox-body Mustang or a 3rd or 4th gen Camaro win an amateur drift event.

And as far as Pontiac trying to steal sales from the Japanese by entering the GTO in drift events, that's just the inverse to what Toyota is trying to do by entering Tundras in NASCAR Craftsman Truck races. It's called marketing, and all companies do it and it's neither reprehensible or an attempt to take over the sport. Nobody is "trying to make the sport their own". If that were the case then Pontiac's sugar daddy GM would be pouring sponsorship money down the SCCA's throat in order to get the rules changed to suit the GTO. Guess what, nothing like that is happening anytime soon.

Hell, Ferrari stakes its road cars' reputation on the fact that they win F1 World Championships and have won Le Mans several times over. In order to compete with Ferrari on Ferrari's level, Pagani, Saleen, Mosler, Aston Martin, Panoz, and Morgan are all sending their cars racing in the same classes that Ferrari competes in. Win on Sunday, Sell on Monday is as old a racing saying as "Gentlemen start your engines." It's proven, it's effective, and to quote Dr. Ferdinand Porsche "Competition improves the breed, thus we race."

No doubt it will be prepped for drifting... to enter into a drift contest w/o being ready for it would just be silly, no-? I never said it could not drift... just not do as well as you people think! C'mon guys... this GTO is not gonna win D1 here! Rhys is a very seasoned Rally-driver and knows all about the basics of drift and some... so he should be able to keep up with these other professionals, right-? NEWS-FLASH-INTO-THE-FUTURE: RHYS WILL NOT GET PAST HIS SECOND ROUND! I bet this car will even get mowed down in FORMULA D... I just know it's not going to do as well as you think... that's my answer and if you guys don't like it... fine.

I'm not gonna argue you anymore... see ya Feb.28th!

some cars are better than others... and that is that!

ok mr. purist, you say its a JAPANESE motorsport, well Mazda is owned by ford, which is American, your z32 is American unless you imported it, 240's are American, if it was made here it is American, yet you say those cars are better than the gto cuz its a domestic, thats the same as American you idiot

ok so old muscle cars aren't good for drifting, I'll agree with you there, but most of the new cars are basically the same as the Japanese cars.

All you need to drift is a RWD car that has somewhat close weight ratio and enough power to handle the weight of the car, incase you don't understand I'm saying the lighter a car is the less power it needs, heavier cars need more power. The most important thing is skill and practice and repitition

to those of you arguing with 1via, let him talk to uselessness, some people (like him) are just closed minded and won't listen to a thing you say. Those people end up getting left behind in everythign so let him think what he wants, hes just an idiot

I personally think the gto is just as capable as most cars in D1 right now, although I don't expect him to get 1st or anything, I do expect him to prove to everyone that he is worthy to be in D1... even if he does go out early who cares? just being able to even compete in D1 makes you good, doesn't mean your amazing or the best, but you have to have a lot of skill that most people don't have to even get there, so stop being a woman about it and accept that its gonna happen and you can't do anything about it... and I'd much rather drift a GTO than your montorous car

OK... no, need to call-names! We are all discussing something here and I'm through with arguing... I think everyone's opinion is valid!

NO... my Z32 is not American-made, jack-ass. It was made in JAPAN just like the WRX's, MR2's, and EVO's. These cars are made in JAPAN and imported here for delivery!

Secondly: I do not drift my Z32 or a Mazda! If you don't like what I have to say about the GTO that's fine... go ahead with your plans and buy one! Maybe you and Rhys Millen can be the American version of Signal's twin Sil-80's. You can tune your car to 400hp just like him and drift all-over... maybe you will both win Formula D together... I can see it already! PONTIAC GTO BEATS ALL IN DRIFT-SHOWOFF! You and he will show evryone that you do not need a ricers car to win! YaY! I'm really happy for you!

anyhow.... Feb. 28th.... see ya there! Can't wait to see you there!

Drift Showoff..hahah..there goes any credibility you have.

...in case you have not noticed... I was being mildly sarcastic... Jesus... I bet I'm talking to a bunch of kids here that don't even own cars! Have any of you actually even attempted a drift??? F'in' posers... I'm through arguing about this crappy GTO... I'm through with this thread...