S2000 in Austrlia.. vs a SS camaro stock vs stock

now don't get me wrong the S2000 is an awe- some car.. i wouldn't mind at all to have one

though a 2001 show down.. between father and son.. was rediculous.

first the S2000 is not a super lightweight..

but the point was 0 to any thing the SS will beat it.. an Slp SS will likely , with added advantage of torque.. on a loose track easily stay ahead of the s2000

now the point i want to make is the S2000 owner said the SS beat it in all aceleration test but one a 70mph roll were he sid the s2000 pulled 4 cars on the SS.. and the SS did make up for it and closed to one upto 130..

now i find this rediculous.. the Ls1 is a high end breather.. and in 2001.. the torque rating is underated.. in no way, vtec or not could an S2000 pull on a SS at that or any speed.. sorry.. not possible.. according to varios S test.. its in its Zone.. the S2000 is a great car no doubt..
but to compare it to the SS.. remeber the SS and all 01-02 Ls1 recieved a variety of Ls6 performance parts.. and high end breathing is no joke.. 165 is easily attainable..

without mods

i'm not being cocky.. but know you place

yes it is a V8 vs a 4.. but as they say ' run what you brung'.. and to even suggest the s2000 can "hang with:" an 01 SS is ludicrouse

I appolgize not spelling you honda A 2000 correctly.. it was a simple typo with an Ir Board.

2810 Lbs curb weight. and 153 peak torque..
vs what is known to be 370 torque and 3343 Lbs.. for a 00 SS curb weight

No detractors?
i know the ar i quck but running down a V8 isn't its best quality

Wow buddy, it looks like you really got the honda community now. I guess we should all go out and buy SS's.

Are you a moron???
The S2000 is a track car, it wasn't even meant to be drag raced.
Of course the SS is going to take it in a straight line, IT IS A DRAG CAR!!!

Thats like saying: "Man, F1 cars are shit! Look at this 7000hp dragster, it will eat ANY F1 car EVER made!"

Believe it or not, there is more to a car than how fast it can go in a straight line.

Go cut the mullet, get a degree in mechanical engineering, then we can discuss engine design.

SS's are 3,554 lbs

Sorry i have a R&T Comparing the SS and the Cobra and the curb is 3353.. or their abouts..

Now psonici..

i do have multiple degree's .. you think an SS is a drag Car.. you sould see the times Slp SS turn.. if it wasn't for their power disadvantage
they'd be right up their with the Z06

i guess you've never heard of the 1le suspension package?
no?

that beast of a car will make a believr out of you.. it funny you think its an attack.. i know its a track car.. .. bt you think America is only good at making thigs go in a straight line.. it your predudice that causes you lash out

the
S2000 is ecplised be an Evo and a Sti for the same price..

and as far as Stock S200.. i'll gladly put up an !le SS or 1le Ws6 anyday and the result.. even with the massive qwweight deficite will be so close.. that in a real road roace..ie to save your life.... the S2000 is overatted..

and my post was just a S2000 owner bragging that he could pull on a car with more than twice the torque and over 100 hp more.

perhaps you need a degree.

Man i knew when i posted the Honda boys would come out guns blazing.. your predictable..

i have a friend with 800 front wheel hp civic.. and yet only with slicks can he turn a low 10.. i'll just say that with alot less Hp My Ws6 easily matched his time.. and i drove to a fro the track

get a degree in what mechanical physics.. what would you like to talk about?.. who say i don't have a degree in physics ? or work in Airforce R&D..?



I'm fully aware of most every cars supenion type.. unfortunately for you
i've seen others.. Ie the S351 Saleens 495 hp 500 Ftlbs of torque running a mere 12.7 as stated by Steve Saleen.. its a track car..
but even though the numbers Jived a Zr1 and a Viper could take it not only in acceleration but on the track

Again perhaps you should see how well ann 1le SS does against a Zo6.. and then get back to me..
the SS is not a DRAG CAR..

Your precious

S2000 is WEAK in the Torque department.. and no amout of rev or V-tec will save it... granted its suspension is fantastic.. but really.. put 200 hp in a Miata and see what happens at the track

And remeber CURB weight.. not race weight or anything else.. this is an official number documented by a scale slip.. and at 2810 the S2000 is no sheer lightweight.. sure its light.. but its is tiny..

And remeber.. i did say a loose course.. the SS would take it.

Christ.. with a Tire change and lowering springs my WS6 skid g went well past a stock C5... or is that a drag car too?

Predictable if not anything else.
Sorry boys the post was on acceleration... but if you wanna go to handling try a 345 hp 1le SS( and thats an underated hp number)

And i think you'll be impressed.. with the live axle beast.

At the Justin Bell racing school.. the Z06 Vette instructors have a hard time staying ahead of the SS 1le instructors.. and thats a quote

Thy say ignorane is bliss.. you keep thinking that.. funny how i put a intergra type r into a tree in 2000 while driving a 99 Ford mustang GT with Subframes.. and polybushings..

Ya see we are talking above the rim F bodys the 1le the Ss, the Ws6.. this isn't a Basic Z-28
he thought in the twisties he would catch me.. he caught a tree instead
At ny rate.. like i thought that story was bull.. no S200 Stock is gonna pull on a SS at 70 mph..lol

some people just have to lie

In actuqality a real tioght course.. with the natural advantage of 1le and massive torque advantage,, keeeping the S2000 in low rpms.. would be just as damaging..

SO YOU'd HAVE TO PICK THE RIGHT COURSE.


NICE TRY trying to change the subject.. too bad either way.. if my life depended on it... i'd be in the 1le SS

And you said it ITS a TRACK car.


How usable is it under 6.5k in everyday traffic..not very, while the 1le SS.. is a blast o drive..

i could care less about its efficiency.. .. if you want to go their then the American designed Wankel rules.. .. IE the rotary 1.3 liter Na 250 hp..?

a track car... and the SS is a Drag car.. you have pretty brad definitions..

i merely stated an Accelaraation test between father and son.. and you turn itt into a Domestic Vs Jap thread.. to bad..
I have seen nothing imported from Japan to rival the 03 cobra , thge Zo6 or the Viper.. and had the continuing efforts on the F body went on.. you can be assured they would also be above par with anything imported from Japan.

Their is nothing wrong with defending your car.. just make sure you know what it is your defending..

Well looks like my post got canned...

I'll try again (this time a little more tame :) )

I don't think the S2000 would be too far off the camaro in the roll test, remember that if you are already rolling, the S2000 would already be revving at about ~7000rpm maybe. As you probably already know, once the s2k gets revving this high, its an all together different car. It probably wouldn't win, but I don't think it would be as far off as you think.

Just a guess

This thread started badly and has gone down hill from there.

The SS is dead. The S2000 is overrated. Move on.













Never pay again for live sex! (http://showmewebcam.com/?p=1) | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! (http://showmewebcam.com/?p=3) | Chat for free! (http://showmewebcam.com/?p=5)

at 70 mph he would haveto be in third.. 2nd maxed out is 65mph
He still lacks an abundnance of torque and hp.

his gearing is spaced. 3rd 65 to 90
the SS is 70 to 95.

it apparentby the acceleration curves that the S2000's best chance are in the low speed. or off the line were it ca take advantage of its weight.. but once rolling. that factory is negated by the 100= exta hp and 170+ extra torque..

01-02 Ls1 were all given Ls6 intake manifolds, Ls6 exhaust manifolds, the 6.0l truck cam andrevised programming..

alot of these cars dyno's in the 320-330 factory stock .. higher than their factory rating..and it showed in the 1/4 times

sub 13 were not uncommon

and no offense to the V-tec but the Ls1 powerband peak tq at 4400 and pk hp at 5200 you've just dropped the hammer in its strongest gear and in its prime rpm range

its aerodynamic.and even making more hp with its its cold air scoop.. stock.. i don't see it happening unless your talking about driver error.. and without a doubt it easier to screw up on the S2000 than the SS..
Agian i have no beef with the S2000.. i just don't see its point.. .. a dedicated track car..? a marvel of hp per liter.. at the cost of ridiculous torque..
as they say your milage may vary

And PSI or 3.14 Started the bashing.. i wouldn't Vr4 your car is dead as well
At least i've still scene 0 mile 02's on the lots for sale.
I didn't think so but you guys really fear the Ls1 you know it exemplifies the virtue .of if it aint broke don't fix it.
i must burn your crust.. that antiquated tech, tqweaked.. as in the Zo6 can produce a World class runner.. with a Cam in block. 2 v 2 wheel drive vehicle.. the Ws6 And SS .. put the import community on hold in any stock for stock comparison.. arcaic.. no the final embodyment of 2 true muscle cars that could do it all

Be ready for the new wave.. its coming , indeed. you guys don't think chronologically..

what happens when the people that brought such outstanding performance in the cam in block 2v motor..Start to step up to Dohc's turbo's and what not.. hmm.. or you think We'll just let you win
Youre gonna have to earn it..take it
Never fond of the Vr4 the turbo setup or its heavy weight.

You are looking at the S2000 from an american point of view
You will never appriciate it doing that.
The car was made to be light, quick, zippy, rip around corners, and brake. It was not meant to peel out of intersections.

How about we do a skid pad/slalom test, and then when the camaro gets its ass kicked, we say "I just don't see the camaro's point!"

Sure the camaro has a point, its just completely different from the S2000, and vice versa.

I find it funny how people keep complaining about the S's torque and saying its garbage, and too expensive. It will beat a boxter in a straight line, on the track, at the gas station, and in the wallet, yet nobody complains about boxters. I bet if the S2000 was a VW or a Toyota, this complaining wouldn't even exist.

If the camaro is such a great car then why did chevy can it?

You are obviously the type of person that only cares about straight line performance, and theres nothing wrong with that (each to his own), But there are other people who look further into a car than that.

also, there are even more to a car than acceleration, and cornering, theres also that driver feed back, response you get, you know that feeling of control in your car, lighter cars usually gets better response. anyways, the camaro handles better with that 1le suspension package, but im betting that in corners, the s2000 will have a higher speed through it, and you say that on a racetrack the camaro will keep up or whatever, but thats probably for a track with long straights, but with continuous turns, i m pretty sure that the s2000 would win.

pretty sure.. well i'm sure that you are wrong.. since the 01-02 Ls1 are more powerful AND BETTER BREATHERS.

PSI , what do youknow of the 1le package.. its an SCCA pakage.. .. hmm.. i guess somone thought your drag car woul make a good road race car..and surprise check even the non 1le number on say my Ws6 Stock. .90 and 64.7.. that matches up quite well considering it also hit 13.18 stock..

now add the !le and you'll find you , once again are incorrect..

all my cars are handlers.. the S2000 is a fine car but it is overated.. you as why they disconinued the F's.. well thats a Beean counter proposition.. it outperformered it competition, loooked better, better interio, better stere.. most blame its intesity to exclude female buyer. negating 1/2 of the buying population and the fact that sport cars in general represent an fraction of the GM profit margin.. it was'nt feesable to keeep the f bod factory open.

Lets see the S2000 enjoy a 35 year history then talk to me.

at least the guy after you knows something of the 1le...

Yousealed your fate when you classified the car as one being a drag and one being a track.. unfortunately for you the 1le f- bodies can easily live in the s200 handle performance world conversely the S2000 can't hang in straight line acceleration or top end.
One car is easy to drive the other require trmedous practice to get right..

and the drag car get 18 city 29 hwy.. better milage than the S2000
so much for efficiency

Your wrong and you know it..
let me sight another statistic the S200 is the #2 Honda.. yet it changes hands more than any other.. cause is tiresoe to get hp only by gettting to the 7000 rpm level .. sadly their for sale all over.. and unlike the NSX it drops value like a rock.. cause no one wants it..
Nsx.. tend to stay in one owners possesion or a long long time

And my post was only to discribe a self proclaimed loser in every category except the 70 mph roll.. which is not possible. the Ls1 is at its prime . like i said in reality it 120hp shy and over 200ftlbs shy.. no way in hell.

now you wanna go 1le.. skid and slaloms.. you better look those up before i make a fool of you.

i live in America and so do you.. so your damn skippy i'm looking at it from an American point of view..and i was born in Italy.

yeah i guess my wifem3 , my Z06 the sti and Evo are all n handler.. even my 95 GTS 5.0 is a lightweight track car..check into those only 6000 were made.

See you don't know you competition i do..
i've never been impressed with the S2000.. sorry.. i've driven them. and they are sad under 6500rpm.. and that is a painful fact you have to live with.
i'm unsubscribed so argue amoung yourselves

PS1i its not that you not intelligent.. its that your young and unknowledgable.. ad too quick on the draw.. you be a perfect target for any of my domstics.. you think you automaticaly have some advantage.. as i blow bye you through the apex of a curve.

HAPPY HUNTING

I agree, the S2000 would not have pulled on the SS.

Yeah I couldn't see how an S2000 could out accelerate any 5.7 Trim 4gen Camaro/Firebird. Like they said, it just lacks the hp/torque to compete at higher acceleration. Maybe it could manage a jump to 40 from a dead stop, but from any roll, I wouldn't think it could out accelerate it. I wouldn't suppose an S2000 being any type of intimidator in straight line performance, but for 240hp why would it? Track performance would be its epic.

And so would a 1le SS.. especially the pre 01liike a 99.. leather.. no ac or radio.. 3200 lbs..and phemomenal track performance.. soorry like said the S2000 is a god car.. but don't dog the Domestics.. especialy thatone or better yet the 1le formula... at 22k.. it will rip a S2000 on trackACING.. LIKE I'VE SAID.. mILE OF aMERICA.. THE F-BODY WIN ALOT.. EVEN OUTPERFORMING AWD pORSHES.. SO LEARN THE COMPETITION LIKE I SAID

I DON'T DISCRETET THE S200.. BUT ITS PLAYINGIN A DIFFERENT..LUGUE.. SO THE FOCUS COSWOTH IT SUPERBLY ABOVE THE S200DOES IT MEAN IT WILL WIN ON THE TRACK OR THE aMRICAM VERSION.. WITH 170 HP AND ITS LIGHTER WEIGHT..


SADLY THE s200O IS OVERATED.. I STANDS NO CHANCE AGAINST A 1LE.. OR A VETTE.. T LAQUES TORQUE AND HP TO DO SO,, REGARDLESS OF IT SUSPENSION.. LIKE I SAID.. I PUT AN itr INT A PALM TREE CAUSE HE THOUGH MY 99 gT WITH SUBFRAES WAS NO HANDLER.. TOO BAD H NEEDED TO PUCH BEYOND THE CARS CPAABILITY TO EVEN ATTEMPT A COM BACK AND HIS RESULT ON A WINDING ROAD WAS A PALM TREE.. DON'T WORRY I WEN BACK TO EE IF HE WAS OK.. BUT I BOOKED.. AFTERER THAT.. HE CHOOS E THE WRONG DRIVER IN THE WRONG CAR

id still have the s2000 over the 1le camaro though. im not a fan of rigid rear axles, and i think the s2000 still handles better than the 1le. the itr is an amazing track car, but the gt will probably get a slightly faster time on the track, cause most tracks will have those long straights, but the itr should corner better than the gt. ive seen some vids of the j spec itr keeping up with cars like the nsx, i was really suprised at how well it did, i guess it all depends on what track you re on.

Should.. i big key word..

like i said your milage may vary.. thre road i was on.. took the Itr through transitios left right then sweeping lft dip and right.. and that where he lost it.... remebe // it not aquestion of machine.. but the symiotic nature of the man and machine
the actuual race i had with my 99 Gt and dubrames.. was a pack of honda'ss the itr being theleader.. he was modded for speed.. but it still din't matter... i known trick is to balnce your Tire pressure to get the max out of your vehicle.. not like the tested cars where the psi in factory recomended

hell i know 125 ccc go carts with 28 hp that can lateral 3g's big deal.
. yes its the track ivolved and no eed for reel long straight.. anything with straight.. and the torque exsit andimediate acceleration properties of a Ls1 especially an 01-02.. ahian.. 1in five had the Ls6 block, andevery 01-02 had ls6 intake, Ls5 exhaust manfold. the truck 6.0liter vortech cam..and advanced programming..as wel as som ancilarry other longeverty part.

ive said i dyno'd stock 320.1 do reverse calc andsee what that it.. your talking almost 380 flywhell hpp.. intersting because thats th 01 Z06 rated hp.. and it wasn't afreek.. most all never deviated between 315 to 30 01-02 bone stock..

Sorry to compare ia S20 to the Nsx is sacraligious inthe Honda world.. its the only car that can match the Vette -(non z06) in haandling and track times.. but with the non use of run flats and the revised Z-51 suspension.. even in the Nsx hey day 00 the nsx t didn't beat the start 350hp harttop vette.. athe track or in striaghtline..

and a 1le f is more than enought o cover the vettes track time add a filter ( cai and a simple cutout 30 bucks.. and hp become earilyclose as does straightline performance
your talking tenths.. when Psionic says the f is a drag car.. when on the track.and those tenths are only in the actual entry and exsit speds.. instriaghtline its a mute point..

Again i feel lik a broken record.. not to piss in you pool.. but the 1le f is no handling slouch. where the S2000 is a straighline slouch 9 stock compared to the 18 city 29 hwy pusrod SS or Ws6..

it doesn't match up well..
and the factt hat you even argue the point.. seems mute.. the 1le , or SS Ws6 or firehwk are born handlers.

ad again i gues the Focus should easily take out the S200 given the apropiate hp and its FWD.. oh and least we forget the ugky thing is domestic.

you can notargue your way out of the facts..

and as the thread was started as a pulling at 70.. that point is also mute.. unless you have retard in the SS.
i rst my case.. and am unsubscribed.. i just like to visit to see.. what you all have to say.
funny i rad a recent report faing the Z4 agaist he boxter.. the boxtr weighs less has the ame hp but has lack of torque and it losses t th Z4.. both with only 225 hp.

i'd think even a very tight track would have the 1Le atan advantage.. whereas you neeed just the right track designed for the 2s000..

by every account it lacks versatility

liek i said let go to go- cart with 3 g's of lateral. in the sceme of things who cares.. what about the 5.0 doner Cobra.. easily capable with only 225hp to tar upas2000 becaause it weighs in the2200-230lbs range.



again the racing frmula one pointmens nothing.. go up toaZ06 aand se how the lighweight s2000 get ripped apart in handling only forget about straigtline


IfPsionic were a realengieer.. he would seethe disparity ofit all..andnot be blinded by his love of the s2000 or honda.. my Sti will rip it part and look od while doing it and at a 125hp per liter. its efficiency it totlly on par.. and since it was designed as a turbo. hpcomes at a cheap cost without any fears of breakdowns.


Face it you so anit domestic.. it clouds your thinking.. i have Gm/ ford and several imports..

my loyalty is too domestics but i appreciate good imports that are usable daily driving or even friday night../ Sunday cruising situations..
the S2000 doesn't qualify.
now the Nsx.. when shall wesee a v8 onl able to approach 400 hp with all this advanced tech...?

hell alotus elise with a Celica Gts engine.. trompson the s200 with a cost of nly 38k.. and its much moreexclusive.. and a subsidiary of gm design

like i said you lose

Ok i got some documented number from Slp..

Psionic how a 3390 curb wwieght.. a .94 skig and a 68.3 slalom grab ya.. that blows the S2000 away..

so much for Honda tech.. and thats stoc

and its not even close to what mods can do to it..

So once again.. your short sightedness.. has proven you wrong.. drag car.. also a 13.2 1/4 mile

so i'd shut up it i were you all
Oh by the way Psionic i'm not one to compare.. but if thats you n the avatar.. you've got a long way to go to catchme brother 20 years in the gym 2.5 hour a day.. and 7 meals a day.. resultng in 20 icj=h cold flexed biceps.. and a 55 ich chest and 29.5 inch thighs all cold measures..

so not only is your engineering skills beloow so too are you physical qualities..

thats for calling me a Moron.. and that dead balls on accuate.. end an e-mail addes and i snd a picture of me that will make you cringe and grope form some GH,or riods.. when i did most of it of the 20only 5 yars on low low dose ananbolic -/non androgenic use.. winnie and primo.. at PDR suggeted levels

as i was a competitor
like i said you guys lose

you loarhing for the Domestic has caused you to be blind.. remeber the US startedthis.. an even if mometarily outgunned always comes back on top
z06, Viper, Ford Gt.. yeah all for a pitance of what the others cost
now i'm out.. ineeded substaintail 1le info and now that i've played mycars your s2000 although good is a joke

Ok i got some documented number from Slp..

Psionic how a 3390 curb wwieght.. a .94 skid and a 68.3 slalom grab ya.. that blows the S2000 away..

so much for Honda tech.. and thats stoc

and its not even close to what mods can do to it..

So once again.. your short sightedness.. has proven you wrong.. drag car.. also a 13.2 1/4 mile

so i'd shut up it i were you all
Oh by the way Psionic i'm not one to compare.. but if thats you n the avatar.. you've got a long way to go to catchme brother 20 years in the gym 2.5 hour a day.. and 7 meals a day.. resultng in 20 icj=h cold flexed biceps.. and a 55 inch chest and 29.5 inch thighs all cold measures..

so not only is your engineering skills below so too are you physical qualities..

thats for calling me a Moron.. and that dead balls on accuate.. Pm an e-mail address and i snd a picture of me that will make you cringe and grope form some GH,or riods.. when i did most of it of the 20 years only 5 years on low low dose ananbolic -/non androgenic use.. winnie and primo.. at PDR suggeted levels

as i was a competitor
like i said you guys lose

you loathing for the Domestic has caused you to be blind.. remeber the US started this.. an even if momentarily outgunned always comes back on top
z06, Viper, Ford Gt.. yeah all for a pitance of what the others cost
now i'm out.. ineeded substaintail 1le info and now that i've played mycars your s2000 although good is a joke

Should.. i big key word..

like i said your milage may vary.. thre road i was on.. took the Itr through transitios left right then sweeping lft dip and right.. and that where he lost it.... remebe // it not aquestion of machine.. but the symiotic nature of the man and machine
the actuual race i had with my 99 Gt and dubrames.. was a pack of honda'ss the itr being theleader.. he was modded for speed.. but it still din't matter... i known trick is to balnce your Tire pressure to get the max out of your vehicle.. not like the tested cars where the psi in factory recomended

hell i know 125 ccc go carts with 28 hp that can lateral 3g's big deal.
. yes its the track ivolved and no eed for reel long straight.. anything with straight.. and the torque exsit andimediate acceleration properties of a Ls1 especially an 01-02.. ahian.. 1in five had the Ls6 block, andevery 01-02 had ls6 intake, Ls5 exhaust manfold. the truck 6.0liter vortech cam..and advanced programming..as wel as som ancilarry other longeverty part.



ive said i dyno'd stock 320.1 do reverse calc andsee what that it.. your talking almost 380 flywhell hpp.. intersting because thats th 01 Z06 rated hp.. and it wasn't afreek.. most all never deviated between 315 to 30 01-02 bone stock..

Sorry to compare ia S20 to the Nsx is sacraligious inthe Honda world.. its the only car that can match the Vette -(non z06) in haandling and track times.. but with the non use of run flats and the revised Z-51 suspension.. even in the Nsx hey day 00 the nsx t didn't beat the start 350hp harttop vette.. athe track or in striaghtline..

and a 1le f is more than enought o cover the vettes track time add a filter ( cai and a simple cutout 30 bucks.. and hp become earilyclose as does straightline performance
your talking tenths.. when Psionic says the f is a drag car.. when on the track.and those tenths are only in the actual entry and exsit speds.. instriaghtline its a mute point..

Again i feel lik a broken record.. not to piss in you pool.. but the 1le f is no handling slouch. where the S2000 is a straighline slouch 9 stock compared to the 18 city 29 hwy pusrod SS or Ws6..

it doesn't match up well..
and the factt hat you even argue the point.. seems mute.. the 1le , or SS Ws6 or firehwk are born handlers.

ad again i gues the Focus should easily take out the S200 given the apropiate hp and its FWD.. oh and least we forget the ugky thing is domestic.

you can notargue your way out of the facts..

and as the thread was started as a pulling at 70.. that point is also mute.. unless you have retard in the SS.
i rst my case.. and am unsubscribed.. i just like to visit to see.. what you all have to say.
funny i rad a recent report faing the Z4 agaist he boxter.. the boxtr weighs less has the ame hp but has lack of torque and it losses t th Z4.. both with only 225 hp.

i'd think even a very tight track would have the 1Le atan advantage.. whereas you neeed just the right track designed for the 2s000..

by every account it lacks versatility

liek i said let go to go- cart with 3 g's of lateral. in the sceme of things who cares.. what about the 5.0 doner Cobra.. easily capable with only 225hp to tar upas2000 becaause it weighs in the2200-230lbs range.



again the racing frmula one pointmens nothing.. go up toaZ06 aand se how the lighweight s2000 get ripped apart in handling only forget about straigtline


IfPsionic were a realengieer.. he would seethe disparity ofit all..andnot be blinded by his love of the s2000 or honda.. my Sti will rip it part and look od while doing it and at a 125hp per liter. its efficiency it totlly on par.. and since it was designed as a turbo. hpcomes at a cheap cost without any fears of breakdowns.


Face it you so anit domestic.. it clouds your thinking.. i have Gm/ ford and several imports..

my loyalty is too domestics but i appreciate good imports that are usable daily driving or even friday night../ Sunday cruising situations..
the S2000 doesn't qualify.
now the Nsx.. when shall wesee a v8 onl able to approach 400 hp with all this advanced tech...?

hell alotus elise with a Celica Gts engine.. trompson the s200 with a cost of nly 38k.. and its much moreexclusive.. and a subsidiary of gm design

like i said you lose

actually its been proven that the itr corners better than the gt all around, but it has a lot to do with the drivers ability, thats why i said should. the nsx-r got the same time as the z06 vette at the nurburgring, and the nsx came out 14 yrs ago. dont forget that some cars are just tuned better than others, so like the car that lost in stock handling will come out on top if both cars were equally tuned well.

there are more ways to measure handling than skidpad, and measuring handling shows a lot of the cars ability, but not all of it.

My reply was that an F body is a drag car..when its anything but that..well a litle..
fact is..

And this is America Buddy.. not Germany.. who cares about that test.. put it on Willow Springs and see what happens..

tell me

what the cost of that NSx compared to say an 02 Z06.. i was loking back then and they were a mere 48k.. s compared to what a NSX t is around 90..

sorry..all the way around.. your Honda stories don't jive..

dman for 90k.. what i the wrld could be done to say Supra, a Ws6 a mustang.. you can totally rebuild the car.. with all coustom suspension components..please.. anyway the NSx is going steal framed and mass produced.. so much for the way i was.. christ you guys arre funny.. a hand assemble formula 1 style suspesion.. vs a mass produced American car.. how silly are you all.. you blind love for a country that loathes you.. YOu yung American ppunks .. bite the hand that feeds you.. perhaps you should travel abroad..and then you understand how very good you have it.
You think we lack tchnology..like i sad..all we need to do is stay in the thick of things.. i dn't see other coming out with a 1000 hp caddilac or the presently produced 750 hp 7.5 liter 4v dohc caddy engine..

yeah thats a whole 100 hp per liter.. and you'll find that as displacment increases like the 2.2 s2000 efficiency has a way of decreasing..

or maybe you all forgot in 89 the Zr1 motor

lol

been their done that..

pushrods work and compete quite well for now.. later all will follow geez look at Ford with their OHC designs require forced induction to be efficient... aand weight is always a factor.. the NSX is slightly lighter than even the c5 zo6 but i think not when the new NSX comes out and the C6 zo6 you'll see equal weights but of course the real makers of V-8's will show its forte

Funny how you honda boys need a V-8 in your new NSx to be competative i thought you all had the answers technology over displacemet..

but fact are fact .. For displacement their is no replacement... remeber that when it come to the competative level.

My previos point in clear a 1le will handle a S2000 easily in twisting winding road.. but the s2000 is no matcxchfor a late f body with an actual ..(not advertised 380+ flywheel hp).. s i said my Ws6 cae to 320.1 in reverse computations that come to well over 380hp actual flywheel..the Nsx and the s2000, weight considered, are no match in a straight line.

Of course Driver makes a difference but we are going on the assumption that these cars are driven my drivers of equal caliber and familiarity of their prospective vehicles..
as when i started this thread.. no_______ way a s200 pulls on a 01 S at hwy speeds.. not even you beloved NSx will.. though that would be closer

lASTLY MY 99 mUSTANG GT WAS A MODED 13.1 CAR.. AND IT WAS SET FOR sCCA MODIFIED STREET.. ON PAPER IT LACKED THE PROPER NUMBER TO HADLE AN ITR.. YET WITHhp AND A GOOD KNOWLEDGE OF THE ROAD..AND DRIVER SKILL.. I WAS ABLE TO PUT IT INTO APALM TREE( DON'T WORRY THE TREE WAS DRY. AND ONLY COSMETIC DAMGE OCCURED, AND I EVEN WENT BACK TO SEE IF ALL WAS OK.. I'M NOT HEARTLESS)

I KNEW THE ROAD WELL, I KNEW THE DIP ONTHAT TURN AND DRIVER SKILL.. I AM A SCCA DRIVER.. SO YOU ARE CORRECT.. DRIVER COMPENTENCY IS A KEY FACTOR..

TRULY IT WAS THE MOST SATISFYING RACE I'V HAD AGAINST A MODED HONDA.. IT SHOW THAT dOMESTICS CAN BE MORE THAN MATCH.. EVEN THOUGH ON APER IT WOULDN'T SEEM SO.
DOMESTICS .. mODERN DOMESTICS ARE NOT DRAG CARS,ON THE CONTRARE.. THEY HANDLE WILL GREAT CONFIDENCE.. THE F-BODYS ARE A PRIME EXAMPLE. AND THEY ARE QUITE HANDSOME AS WELL.. MUSCLE CAARS WITH OUTSTSNDING HSNDLING QUALITIES.


IT YOU AN TO SEE A ENGINEERING MISTSKE LOOK AT THE 03 COBRA WITH 3.55 REAR END AND MASSIVE TORQUE AT VERY LOW END IT TRACTION MAKE IT9 IN HOT OD MSGAZINE A 13.3 CAR STOCK.

SADLY I TOLD MANY FORD OWNER THIS WOULD BE A MAJORPROBLM

THE sTISTOCKCAN BEAT IT IN A DRAGADAFW1OSON THRCK.I'D WATCHT THEGT. ON PAPER ITMAY NOT SHOW THE BEST AHNDLING NUBER BUT WITH THE RIGHT DRIVR ... A WHEEL MAN.. ITS ALOT OF CAR. AND IT 1/4 MILE TIME IS TOTALLY AN UNTRUE NUMBER IT QUITE FASTER
I KNOW SOME HIGH LEVEL GM PERFORMANCE INSIDERS..JUSTLIKE I CAN ASURE YOU AN ss WILL BE PRODUCED.. WITH 430= HPAND SOMELIKE 460 - 48- TORQUE.. GM IS NOT MESSING ARONGANYMORE.. THEY MEAN TOTAKE CLAIM OF ALL aMERICAN SOLDCAR IN THE PERFORMANCEDIVISION..

THE sOLTICEWILLBE MORETHAN WHAT A S200CAN HANDLE

LUTZ IS A PERFORMANCE GUY.. AND HE DOESN'TLIKE NEING SECOND TOANYONE

AND QUALLITY.FITAND FINIS ANDINTERIOR DESIGM..ISALSOON HISLIST..

EMEBER GM IS THELRGESTMOTORCOMPANY IN THEWORLD.. YOU DON'TGETTHEIRBYPRODUCING INFERIORPRODUCT..ALTHOUGH FORAATIMETHEY DIDNDOUBT..PEOPLEFORGETTHING..IE THEQUAD4.. GM KNOWS IS SHIT

THE BEAN COUNTER CAUSE ALOT OF HAVOCK WITH THE BOARD.. DO YOU REALY THING THE F BODY'S WERE INFERIOR CARS.. NONPROPAGANDA.ND ITOVERALLAPPEALTOTHE MUSCLECAR CROWD9MALES0.. WAS ITSDOWNFALL

ALOTOF PEOPLE DON'T KOW THISBUT INSTEAD OFASTRPING PAACKAGEFOR THE SSAND WS6 THEIR WERE SOLID PLANS FOR ALIMITEDAMOUNT A02 ls6 MOTORS AS THE FAREWELL F BODY BUT AGAIN THE BEAN COUNTERS..WON

YOU HONDA GUYS.. . REALLY I DON'TTHINK HODA'SARECRA..HELLA CIVIC SI IN BLUE ALMOST CAUGHT MY NON MOIFIED 5.0..9WELL IT HAD MINOR MODS0.. IT HIT IT IN 2ND AND THIRD.. I WAS AHGHEAD.. I KEPT IT IN 4RTH.. AS HE WAS AT MY BUMPER.. I STARTEDPULLING ON HIM.. AND AT THE LIGHT.. HE REFUSED ARACE.. HE KNEW I'D DOG HIM

BUT HIS CATCHUP WITH MY DOWNSHIFTE=WAS VERY GGO.. HE AS ALSO MODERATELY MODDED

AND THATS IT..I REALLY ON'THATEHONDA'SBUTMOST HODA DRIVER LOOK AT DOMSTIC WITH DISTASTE..TOO BAD.. WE RETOOLED JAPAN AFTER WW2
WE GAVE THEM A JUMPSTART

LATER SONIC 1050 SIGNING OFF

My reply was that an F body is a drag car..when its anything but that..well a litle..
fact is..

And this is America Buddy.. not Germany.. who cares about that test.. put it on Willow Springs and see what happens..

tell me

what the cost of that NSx compared to say an 02 Z06.. i was loking back then and they were a mere 48k.. s compared to what a NSX t is around 90..

sorry..all the way around.. your Honda stories don't jive..

dman for 90k.. what i the wrld could be done to say Supra, a Ws6 a mustang.. you can totally rebuild the car.. with all coustom suspension components..please.. anyway the NSx is going steal framed and mass produced.. so much for the way i was.. christ you guys arre funny.. a hand assemble formula 1 style suspesion.. vs a mass produced American car.. how silly are you all.. you blind love for a country that loathes you.. YOu yung American ppunks .. bite the hand that feeds you.. perhaps you should travel abroad..and then you understand how very good you have it.
You think we lack tchnology..like i sad..all we need to do is stay in the thick of things.. i dn't see other coming out with a 1000 hp caddilac or the presently produced 750 hp 7.5 liter 4v dohc caddy engine..

yeah thats a whole 100 hp per liter.. and you'll find that as displacment increases like the 2.2 s2000 efficiency has a way of decreasing..

or maybe you all forgot in 89 the Zr1 motor

lol

been their done that..

pushrods work and compete quite well for now.. later all will follow geez look at Ford with their OHC designs require forced induction to be efficient... aand weight is always a factor.. the NSX is slightly lighter than even the c5 zo6 but i think not when the new NSX comes out and the C6 zo6 you'll see equal weights but of course the real makers of V-8's will show its forte

Funny how you honda boys need a V-8 in your new NSx to be competative i thought you all had the answers technology over displacemet..

but fact are fact .. For displacement their is no replacement... remeber that when it come to the competative level.

My previos point in clear a 1le will handle a S2000 easily in twisting winding road.. but the s2000 is no matcxchfor a late f body with an actual ..(not advertised 380+ flywheel hp).. s i said my Ws6 cae to 320.1 in reverse computations that come to well over 380hp actual flywheel..the Nsx and the s2000, weight considered, are no match in a straight line.

Of course Driver makes a difference but we are going on the assumption that these cars are driven my drivers of equal caliber and familiarity of their prospective vehicles..
as when i started this thread.. no_______ way a s200 pulls on a 01 S at hwy speeds.. not even you beloved NSx will.. though that would be closer

this is america buddy? hahaha... its a track buddy, who freakin cares what country its in, its about the style of the track, it doesnt have to be all american, only american. anyways the nurburgring has long straights, i think its one of the most balanced track, and the reason why a lot car companies measure performance on that track. the nsx-r has around 290 hp, while the z06 has about 400, and the nsx-r gets the same time as the z06, even if the nsx-r is lighter, the z06 is still faster in the straights, but they both get the same time, this shows that the nsx-r corners better. some engines will just make more hp for a given displacement, like if you modified both engines the same way, or just added on parts to its limits, one of them will produce more power for a given displacement. but of course, the corvettes engine is a lot bigger, so not easy for a n/a engine almost half the size to produce similar power, and yea i know that torque thing. you talk about cost, but the nsx obviously uses better material, like its all aluminum, so its mostly corrosion free, and has better quality, theres a reason why it costs more, plus it would cost more cause it would be imported. still the z06 is less, duh i know that part, but theres also a reason why the nsx costs more, and if you dont care, i could simply care less about what you think on price, you have your opinions, i got mine.

lASTLY MY 99 mUSTANG GT WAS A MODED 13.1 CAR.. AND IT WAS SET FOR sCCA MODIFIED STREET.. ON PAPER IT LACKED THE PROPER NUMBER TO HADLE AN ITR.. YET WITHhp AND A GOOD KNOWLEDGE OF THE ROAD..AND DRIVER SKILL.. I WAS ABLE TO PUT IT INTO APALM TREE( DON'T WORRY THE TREE WAS DRY. AND ONLY COSMETIC DAMGE OCCURED, AND I EVEN WENT BACK TO SEE IF ALL WAS OK.. I'M NOT HEARTLESS)

I KNEW THE ROAD WELL, I KNEW THE DIP ONTHAT TURN AND DRIVER SKILL.. I AM A SCCA DRIVER.. SO YOU ARE CORRECT.. DRIVER COMPENTENCY IS A KEY FACTOR..

TRULY IT WAS THE MOST SATISFYING RACE I'V HAD AGAINST A MODED HONDA.. IT SHOW THAT dOMESTICS CAN BE MORE THAN MATCH.. EVEN THOUGH ON APER IT WOULDN'T SEEM SO.
DOMESTICS .. mODERN DOMESTICS ARE NOT DRAG CARS,ON THE CONTRARE.. THEY HANDLE WILL GREAT CONFIDENCE.. THE F-BODYS ARE A PRIME EXAMPLE. AND THEY ARE QUITE HANDSOME AS WELL.. MUSCLE CAARS WITH OUTSTSNDING HSNDLING QUALITIES.


IT YOU AN TO SEE A ENGINEERING MISTSKE LOOK AT THE 03 COBRA WITH 3.55 REAR END AND MASSIVE TORQUE AT VERY LOW END IT TRACTION MAKE IT9 IN HOT OD MSGAZINE A 13.3 CAR STOCK.

SADLY I TOLD MANY FORD OWNER THIS WOULD BE A MAJORPROBLM

THE sTISTOCKCAN BEAT IT IN A DRAGADAFW1OSON THRCK.I'D WATCHT THEGT. ON PAPER ITMAY NOT SHOW THE BEST AHNDLING NUBER BUT WITH THE RIGHT DRIVR ... A WHEEL MAN.. ITS ALOT OF CAR. AND IT 1/4 MILE TIME IS TOTALLY AN UNTRUE NUMBER IT QUITE FASTER
I KNOW SOME HIGH LEVEL GM PERFORMANCE INSIDERS..JUSTLIKE I CAN ASURE YOU AN ss WILL BE PRODUCED.. WITH 430= HPAND SOMELIKE 460 - 48- TORQUE.. GM IS NOT MESSING ARONGANYMORE.. THEY MEAN TOTAKE CLAIM OF ALL aMERICAN SOLDCAR IN THE PERFORMANCEDIVISION..

THE sOLTICEWILLBE MORETHAN WHAT A S200CAN HANDLE

LUTZ IS A PERFORMANCE GUY.. AND HE DOESN'TLIKE NEING SECOND TOANYONE

AND QUALLITY.FITAND FINIS ANDINTERIOR DESIGM..ISALSOON HISLIST..

EMEBER GM IS THELRGESTMOTORCOMPANY IN THEWORLD.. YOU DON'TGETTHEIRBYPRODUCING INFERIORPRODUCT..ALTHOUGH FORAATIMETHEY DIDNDOUBT..PEOPLEFORGETTHING..IE THEQUAD4.. GM KNOWS IS SHIT

THE BEAN COUNTER CAUSE ALOT OF HAVOCK WITH THE BOARD.. DO YOU REALY THING THE F BODY'S WERE INFERIOR CARS.. NONPROPAGANDA.ND ITOVERALLAPPEALTOTHE MUSCLECAR CROWD9MALES0.. WAS ITSDOWNFALL

ALOTOF PEOPLE DON'T KOW THISBUT INSTEAD OFASTRPING PAACKAGEFOR THE SSAND WS6 THEIR WERE SOLID PLANS FOR ALIMITEDAMOUNT A02 ls6 MOTORS AS THE FAREWELL F BODY BUT AGAIN THE BEAN COUNTERS..WON

YOU HONDA GUYS.. . REALLY I DON'TTHINK HODA'SARECRA..HELLA CIVIC SI IN BLUE ALMOST CAUGHT MY NON MOIFIED 5.0..9WELL IT HAD MINOR MODS0.. IT HIT IT IN 2ND AND THIRD.. I WAS AHGHEAD.. I KEPT IT IN 4RTH.. AS HE WAS AT MY BUMPER.. I STARTEDPULLING ON HIM.. AND AT THE LIGHT.. HE REFUSED ARACE.. HE KNEW I'D DOG HIM

BUT HIS CATCHUP WITH MY DOWNSHIFTE=WAS VERY GGO.. HE AS ALSO MODERATELY MODDED

AND THATS IT..I REALLY ON'THATEHONDA'SBUTMOST HODA DRIVER LOOK AT DOMSTIC WITH DISTASTE..TOO BAD.. WE RETOOLED JAPAN AFTER WW2
WE GAVE THEM A JUMPSTART

LATER SONIC 1050 SIGNING OFF

bringin up ww2? ok, i agree with you to a certain degree, that we helped them get more money and stuff, but the way you said it is ignorant.

just cause someone hates mustangs and camaros doesnt mean they re jap lovers, antiamericans, or only imports lovers, they just dont like the way it looks, and they dont like the way it is overall. although i like certain mustangs, and camaros, i have friends that dont like the newer mustangs, and camaros, cause of the way they look, but they own those old muscle cars, like the 68 california special mustang, and the 69 camaro.

if gm's so great, then why did they turn to honda engineers for help on their new engines? honda doesnt showoff with the cars they build, but they re engineering is really good, you think they re gonna listen to enthusiasts all the time? almost every car company would rather go for highest sales. if you look at f1, when they were going all out, they were always second, while ferrari was first, but honda was close to ferrari. you know mclaren was using honda engines in their f1 cars, and they went to honda for an engine for their new car mclaren f1 when it was first being designed. it made sense for them to go with honda, but they new how good their engines were, but honda turned them down, so they turned to bmw. im not trying to act like hondas superior or anything, but you were talking down on them, so i felt like saying this. if you re saying that you dont like the way honda builds cars, like that they dont have enough torque, then i could understand that, but from what i read, thats not what it sounded like, sounded like you were trying to talk down on their engineering ability, and trying to talk down on them cause of what country its from, and thats just ignorant.

Wow. This whole time he sounds like a fool bragging about camaros in broken English, and then he even has the idiocy to mention he has a mustang. Don't people learn from their mistakes? American cars suck. They're not even an option. Try driving an s2000. One word: SOLID

Why don't you drive my wifes Modena.. one word class, or the M3.. or a Zo6 which you haven't..

how about the CTSv.. the Vipewr the Ford Gt .. yeah they all suck.. and the C6 is here sticing it right in your dace at 50k no price hike..



Polar movement is the key to NSx's times.. and a NSX-r.. wow.. for that proce i'll make a Mustang Steeda Stage 3 handle as well and destroy it in top end and accelration

you guys have to be living in the past..

The NSx.. its a joke.. 90k . i could give a sht about it high tech aluminum.. to meet safety standard in euroe for 05 they will have to switch to steal or don't you read up on your stuff..

GM is the largest auto- maker in the world.. if it asks for help so what.. still the Zo6 has no aluminum .. doesn't benifit from polar movement, weighs more.. and has a ppushrod motor..

.. and your best can barely keep up.. i'll research this.. i know the prototype NSx r did run well.. but as i said we are in America..

i'm sorry the logc is if it work it works.. a pushrod motor.. kills it.. look to the Viper.. the car stop in just about 100 feet in 60-0

Now you want to go back to Camaroes.. let shall we

i've given you a 1le spec.. and on paper this antiquated car show miraculous number.. but thats ok.. with a 50 hp disadvantage and about300 heavier .. at willow sprng it proved itself to hang with zo6 it was slower .. but not that much.. all were shocked..



Now you throw a NSx into the fray a 90k car.. c'mon thats a joke.. and no i don't appreciate a Ferrari wanna be see no cassin trying to immitate a legend and then call it classy.. its a copy car like japan is known for.

Now lets address the S2000.. i've driven severa.. and the are shit for all around driving.. the do accel at the track.. as a Scca Modified street.. idon't see it touching my Mustang.. yesa 95 GTS you wouldn't know.. the S designate a lightweight plateform..

and the car cooks
Again we live in America and on american roads do these showdowns occur.. i see no way a nsx no a s2000 is worthy of any priase when even in 92 a Firehwk 1le would wipe out a NSx and a s2000 in almst every comparison that matters..



you al go on and talk about interior and what not... non essentilistic matter..



NAND I THINK SOME IS TALKING ABOUT fORDSgt WHN THEY ASKED hONDA FOR HELP..

LOL


HELP FOR WHAT MAY I ASK
i know some real higher ups in the Gm stucture.. and they didn't seem to need help with the ls6 nor the new c6 zo6 motor coming soon.
they needed no help with 1000hp caddy motor.. nor the presently produced 750hp 7.5 liter dohc 4 v engine

My god you all are stupid.. if they want to know they buy the car a nd tear it apart.. what do you think the Japs do????

Anyway.. i don't see any NSx in the near Future tuochng my 427 TT Nos foogger LPE vette.. nor my NA 427 Ws6.. well it does have Nos

and they emit no squeaks .. .my Ws6 was at 165 the other day .. some as glass with plenty left.. oh thatsright a s2000 can't go up that high and a NSX would be right at it limit,, meaniing a short stay at that speed and then back down

Like glass..

and yes eveni was surprised. i though it would feel rougher.. but not at all..

For the record no matter what break r ho god they are .. you have i don't recommend going that fast.. it dones take a bit of time to get down unless you stand on it..

i don't abuse my cars

Honda.. i could give 2 shits and a piss about them ..i'll ever buy on on principal.. and Jpa cars suck... you need every technological trick in the book to make them competatve.. were we old hicks doit just a well or better .. without.. so which one is the more efficient..

dropping a free falling bomb on a target and having a hit.. every time.. or a smartbomb..
you have to play devils advocate..
can't wait for the new c6 can't wait to buy my wife a Caddy CTS-v.. faster at Nurburgr than any pre993 Porsche 911 the RS 3.8 and Better than the M#..

American cars suck? This is a five passenger Caddilac

and its cost 47k

Don't worry you have the Golf R32.. which tuner have alrady done icredible things with the Sotice is coming the Elise(GM owned i beleive)

the recent pain in your sides the Srt4 only getting better..

yeep we suck

i could easy..or rather did give you a list of affordable car America make and kic Ass.. funny we have the most advanced military and Space programs but you all think it does or can't trickle to the automotive industry.. we make just what we need..

and Honda
NSX was a show off piece.. no question.. if not why not mass produce it drop its cost.. exactly their is no answer

Youlove japan so much go live their

you be running home in less than 3 months..
you bite the hand that feed you..

you children ar the most disgusting breeed . narcessist of all time

and my broken eglish..
well it was good enoughthat after taking esol

i graduate wih a masters from
Rensselear Polytechnic Institute..

so you may want to reconsider the source..

Yeah im sure anyone of you would pick a S2000 free over a Viper or Z06

see how much trim you get in a real mans car
you've been branwashed.. and i'm here to tell ou
just wait . when the SS come out the Judge Gto 9 us made0 the C6, the C6 z06 the Ford lightning, the Ford Mustang Cobra (05) the ram Srt10.. even the awd single cab revised Silverado SS.. with a LS6 in it awd

You have't a clue the storm thats brewing

and America never take a second seat to anyone.. how do you think we bat the USSSr we outspent them till they became banrupt trying to keep upwith their military..
but hey go back to your Video cube/ station.. live their..

And i recant.. because i'm not arrogant .. Honda doesn' suck their good.. but we are better ..and always will be.. becaus we are Ameria.. and if you don't bleiv it i suggest you live in any country any.. and see

Italy is but a fond memeory ..i'd never live their again

peace boys

kep mag racing.. when youhave more than 7 real cars talk to me

For he record the about to be replace Z06 in stck suspension setting and tire ran the ring in 7min 55secs

the fastest are the GT2 and GT3 at around 7:30

a top Formula 1 carrns it in 6:40

Once again lets recap this is a 3150 lbs car with pushrod NA engine..lol

You seee i fnd you guys confusing you talk about efficiency.. were? the NSx cost mor use more gas.. . are techno wonders that can ALMOST match antiquated technogy for hlf the price.. and don't str with the looks thing.. a Zo6 looks Smokng trust me add some lighter weight(ie rotaional mass) Centerlin wheels.. tint maybe some Ecklers chrome bezels SS exhuast..and then interior,, a true aluminum kit is 560 dollars and the whole interior goes from gothic to Audi..

Your out of excuses and no emissions legal NSX ever kept up with a Zo6 n any track.. prototype don't count.. production models do.

Get it stright..

and the Caddy does in in 35 more seconds at Nurburgring...

yes sir i see just how badly Americans suck considering Both those cars together cost less than a R

You should play with someone in your own sub digit IQ world

I'll be happy to start balstig away techical jargon in Italian..and see if any of you can understand let alone equal my writing skills. as you writting Italian as i write English..

lest we forget i'm on an IR board not the new ones that just came out.. this one is 4 years old.. and use it at 15' distance and never use spell check nor proof..
let see you do that

I admire your passion.. though that why we had to Nuke Japan cause their to stupid to know when theve been defeated.
You think they like you just because you buy their product.. the spit at you they hate your very being.. hence my lack of support to their economy
to anal to be human

YOU LOSE

i dont care what you say, cause a lot of it has to do with your own opinion, and some of it are full of ignorant comments. its just impossible to prove ignorant people like you.

just cause you live in a nation thats superior military wise, does not make you superior to people in other countries, thats total bs.

Believe it or not, there is more to a car than how fast it can go in a straight line.

Man, you're my new hero!..
There are some retards who just won't understand that fact. :screwy:

lol, im actaully debating on whether i should buy an SS or S2000.s2000 is a very nice car but like the saying goes..."there's NO replacement for decplacment" ! ! ! ! !! :P