How nitrous works

Can anyone explain to me precisely how nitrous works?

Here are a couple of articles that explain it quite well
http://www.utahstangs.com/subdirs/tech.info/nitrous/nitrousworks.htm
http://www.mercurycapri.com/technical/engine/n2o/nitro.html
http://www.dragracingonline.com/technical/nitrousnews/n2opits/ii_2.html

Happy reading

Thank you.

Can you add nitrous to a turbocharged engine?

Yes...but any increase in engine HP is a result of increased combustion pressures, both Nitros and forced induction increase combustion pressures dramatically, so using both can cause major failure unless you really know what you are doing

Well i hope you understand how nitrous wokrs, now with whatever article you were directed to, though for anyone checking out the thread and too lazy to read or even click, essentialy nitrous (N2O) is composed of two aprts nitrogen one part oxygen, the key to this performance enhancing fluid is the oxygen not the nitrogen. This is beacause oxygen supports combustion, introducing this oxygen will enrich the air with 11% more oxygen than it previously had, all the details there get techincal. But now someone may ask, well then why not just use pure oxygen instead of using any nitrogen at all, well initialy this does not sound like a bad idea, but when too much oxygen is introduced into the cylinder at the point of cumbustion there is simply too much oxygen fueling this powerstroke, this results in EXTREMELEY high temperatures that will kill your engine and specificly your cylinders. This is why we toos in the nitrogen, hopefuly your highschool career has taught you that nitrogen is an extremeley cold substance, c'mon now you remember, the one that was always boiling and was spewing steam everywhere. Yeah well anywas, this nitrous well also have a cooling effect in your powerstroke, so now your 11% increase in oxygen will not have any severe adverse effects on your engine, though you may want to slighty tune it anyways.

Secondley, can you have NOS and a Turbocharger, I suppose it is possible, but not a very good idea. A charger will force induction, so having your nitrous forcefuly induced into your engine could result in, i don't even know, but certainly not good. The HP being demanded out of the engine would probably result in, damn i have NOOOO CLUE! just don't do it, unless you are absolutley your engine will handle it.

Not bad for a 15 year old eh?

I've heard about people avoiding turbo lags by using Nitrous shots. Is this possible?

Originally posted by tegusdrifter
I've heard about people avoiding turbo lags by using Nitrous shots. Is this possible?


yes some drag racers use it just for that....

another very good result of using nitrous and turbo is the cooling effect that N2O has on the heated air blown by the turbo

the biggest problem with this setup is that it makes it much harder to tune the turbo engine if you add nitrous in the combination.....

and lanevo put it very well.....any compound with a higher percentage of O2 than nitrous will cause a very violent explosion(detonation) instead of the smooth explosions that are optimal to power the engine....one thing that you got a bit confused about is the nitrogen....it is not the nitrogen itself that causes the cooling effect is the whole N2O gas.....any gas that expands will have an endotermic effect not just nitrogen

Thanks for the correction Neutrino,

But as for using nitrous shots to defeat turbo lag, yes it is possible to do that, tho not all that common, typicly only drag racers use it. But since your name consists of the word drift, maybe it would be helpful to know about anti-lag systems.

Often called bang-bangs they allow misfires in the engine so that there will still be exhaust heading to the exhaust system allowing the turbo to keep on spooling even when your foot is off the gas. Rally racers use this system all the time, if you ever watch WRC stages, whenever you see a rally racer take a corner you will often hear some very loud bangs these are the misfires that the anti-lag system creates, i find that these systems are most often used on Lancers and Imprezas though it is possible to find them on other cars.

These are very rare for any street racer to have tho, these are extremeley exspensive systems, and will kill your engine in a matter of weeks or even days.

Originally posted by LanEvo


Often called bang-bangs they allow misfires in the engine so that there will still be exhaust heading to the exhaust system allowing the turbo to keep on spooling even when your foot is off the gas. Rally racers use this system all the time, if you ever watch WRC stages, whenever you see a rally racer take a corner you will often hear some very loud bangs these are the misfires that the anti-lag system creates, i find that these systems are most often used on Lancers and Imprezas though it is possible to find them on other cars.

These are very rare for any street racer to have tho, these are extremeley exspensive systems, and will kill your engine in a matter of weeks or even days.


yes those anti lag systems are very nice.....gotta love those pops:bigthumb:

gotta love those pops

ahh yes how sweet it is.

Originally posted by LanEvo


ahh yes how sweet it is.
as homer would say mmmmm......antilag.....drool

The system you are referring to is actually quite simple, we used it on several of our pro rally cars. An injector is mounted in the exhaust pipe just upstream from the turbo, when activated any time the throttle is released a signal is sent to open the injector which introduces fuel into the exhaust manifold (header). Because of the high temperatures the fuel ignites immediately and the expanding gasses keep the turbo spooled up, at the same time generating those "cool" backfires, the system is hard as hell on the exhaust but works good to maintain turbo speed.

Originally posted by Volvord 784VC
The system you are referring to is actually quite simple, we used it on several of our pro rally cars. An injector is mounted in the exhaust pipe just upstream from the turbo, when activated any time the throttle is released a signal is sent to open the injector which introduces fuel into the exhaust manifold (header). Because of the high temperatures the fuel ignites immediately and the expanding gasses keep the turbo spooled up, at the same time generating those "cool" backfires, the system is hard as hell on the exhaust but works good to maintain turbo speed.


yeah but you can tell bye bye to the turbo very soon.....


btw i though that it worked by causing the engine to misfire and dump some unburned fuel into the exaust manifold.....:confused:


are there two types of systems or was i wrong

Hmm I have never heard of your version Volvord, i do not mean to contradict you and please do enlighten me and correct me if i am wrong,

But the way i know it is that when you let up on the gas, the anti-lag system will keep a butterfly valve about halfway open, so when your foot is off the gas but fuel is still coming in, the cycles won't be timed properly which results in a purposeful misfire, dumping semi combusted fuel into the exhaust manifold to "feed" or spool the turbo.

Originally posted by LanEvo
Hmm I have never heard of your version Volvord, i do not mean to contradict you and please do enlighten me and correct me if i am wrong,

But the way i know it is that when you let up on the gas, the anti-lag system will keep a butterfly valve about halfway open, so when your foot is off the gas but fuel is still coming in, the cycles won't be timed properly which results in a purposeful misfire, dumping semi combusted fuel into the exhaust manifold to "feed" or spool the turbo.

i knew the same thing....maybe its some new system or something:confused:

The version I describe is common and used by many racers. Think of it, the result of either method is providing unburt fuel to pass through into the exhaust where it will ignite, these expanding gasses will maintain a reasonable turbo speed, it does not have any detrimental effect of turbocharger life. In my opinion I would prefer the system I describe, raw fuel passing through an engine promotes fuel washing of the cylinder wall, oil dilution, and the high risk of detonation.

In my opinion I would prefer the system I describe, raw fuel passing through an engine promotes fuel washing of the cylinder wall, oil dilution, and the high risk of detonation.

Absoluteley right, I would too, but the one thing i don't understand with your systme

unburt fuel to pass through into the exhaust where it will ignite

How will it ignite in your manifold? purley by pressure? please do reply I am very interested in this system.

Originally posted by LanEvo


How will it ignite in your manifold? purley by pressure? please do reply I am very interested in this system.

Heat, since you are injecting raw gas into the exhaust manifold within a foot of the port the heat alone is enough to ignite the fuel.

Ohh i get it, so it is pureley the heat that cause combustion, wow by passing the engine completley, you must get one helluva bag outta that sucker.

Originally posted by Volvord 784VC
reasonable turbo speed, it does not have any detrimental effect of turbocharger life.




how can it not be bad for the turbo when it has unburned gas ignite inside it:confused:

The temperature of the cumbustion gases leaving the exhaust port are much higher than fuel burning in the pipe, also remember that the system only functions when the throttle is released, and is only designed to maintain turbo speed for a short period of time. The actual ignition of the fuel takes place prior to the turbo, but a turbo system is designed to funtion in a high heat environment. How is this any different or harder on a turbo than an engine running at 6000+rpm and the turbo producing 1.5 bar boost? I know when I was racing the time the accelerator was not pressed hard to the floor was rare

Originally posted by Volvord 784VC
The temperature of the cumbustion gases leaving the exhaust port are much higher than fuel burning in the pipe, also remember that the system only functions when the throttle is released, and is only designed to maintain turbo speed for a short period of time. The actual ignition of the fuel takes place prior to the turbo, but a turbo system is designed to funtion in a high heat environment. How is this any different or harder on a turbo than an engine running at 6000+rpm and the turbo producing 1.5 bar boost? I know when I was racing the time the accelerator was not pressed hard to the floor was rare

i was not thinking of the heat i was thinking about the impact caused by the shockwave of the explosion....can't that posibly damage the turbo blades?

It would not be an explosion, the fuel would burn in the exhaust pipe which is quite different from an explosion or detonation. The key is that the burning fuel expands and it is these expanding gasses that maintain turbine speed. The backfiring that is heard, although noisy, does not actually create percusion or shock waves.

I understand what Volvord is saying Neutrino, when the fuel finaly combusts in the exhaust manifold it's the exploding out of the exhaust that makes the big bang, though i find that this version of an anti-lag system, would send more flames out of the exhaust, your turbo won't take much damage, but your muffle might get josseled up.

Muffler? who uses a muffler? and besides a muffler used on a competition vehilce is usually placed as far back on the exhaust system as possible, cooler exhaust and lower gas speeds. I would not recommend this system on any street car, ya there are some flames but most are disapated by the turbo, but they are loud and you would attract the attention of every law enforcement member in the county

Originally posted by Volvord 784VC
Muffler? who uses a muffler? and besides a muffler used on a competition vehilce is usually placed as far back on the exhaust system as possible, cooler exhaust and lower gas speeds. I would not recommend this system on any street car, ya there are some flames but most are disapated by the turbo, but they are loud and you would attract the attention of every law enforcement member in the county


can you turn it off and on?

Hahaha no kidding, and also a lot of WRC cars now must use mufflers, the . . . argh forgot the abbreviation, the international racing folks up ih there big headquarters, are beginning to restrict noise pollution, as for the street, you still gotta pass e-testing so i'd get a muffler just one of those noisy ones, that's always fun, and hell no, if you put an anti-lag system in your street car, or any car that you personaly own, your in for a world of hell, you'll have to rebuild your engine every single week.

And of course the officers will hear you from 5 blocks away, like you said ;)

Originally posted by LanEvo
Hahaha no kidding, and also a lot of WRC cars now must use mufflers, the . . . argh forgot the abbreviation, the international racing folks up ih there big headquarters, are beginning to restrict noise pollution, as for the street, you still gotta pass e-testing so i'd get a muffler just one of those noisy ones, that's always fun, and hell no, if you put an anti-lag system in your street car, or any car that you personaly own, your in for a world of hell, you'll have to rebuild your engine every single week.

And of course the officers will hear you from 5 blocks away, like you said ;)

well the sysrem he listed would not affect the engine since it starts in the exaust manifold....the only thing i was worried was the turbo but he sais that it will not be bad for it so i don't see what the problem would be to use it anytime....except noise of course

Although the anti-lag system seems very attractive, I have heard that it does indeed do damage to the turbo and it is very expensive. If the NOS shot does the trick for reducing turbo lag, I wonder which would give the engine a longer life span, in other words which way will cause less damage to the engine or turbo before eventually killing it?

With an Anti-Lag system (upwrds of $7000 american) you know that you are going to kill your engine. Progressiveley and very quickly. Just about killing the engine in one moth of normal driving, if you don't up keep your engine. Though at least your enginge won't blow up in your fac as the case may be wit Nitrous Oxide Systems (NOS)

A NOS shot typicly is not used with forced induction systems, unless you are absoluteley sure of what you are doing. If you have nay mistiming in your cams, then your enging will probably start billowing out white smoke due to a bent vavle, or if you lucky just a glown seal somewhere.

But i generally would not combine the two, as both tend to be more useful for different motorsports. NOS, is stypicly used in straightline events (dragracing) to give you that extra horsepower you need to boost your way to the finish line. Turbo is something that is designed more for auto cross, allowing you to recieve boosts of power while going along straight aways and then allow you to loose that power through a turn much like AutoX or Drifting.

Just imagine haveing to use these with other sports, using NOS, but then find that you are about to go into a hairpin, you drop your RPMs and your NOS shot was wasted, or using turbo on a drag strip not that bad an idea, but it won't give you the same boost that NOS will, and when opposing someone using NOS they will most likeley fly by you.

I really don't understand why these constant replies on antilag systems shortening engine life. The only shortening of engine life would be due to the higher than stock HP any competion engine produces, these increased stresses will shorten an engines life. The other factor would be an improper engine assembly, which is usually the case. NOS is not be used for any long event, simple reason, a 10 lb bottle is only good for about 2:30 minutes of use, not a real advantage in longer races especially factoring in the weight of equipment. Yes NOS is a real option at 1/4 mile racing. Anti lag systems are usually used in high boost engines that use larger turbochargers, the larger turbo results in an increase in boost levels but also an increase in lag time, to maintain a higher turbo speed at lower engine speeds a system in employed such as described in this thread. It is the very high boost levels that will shorten the engine life not the anti lag system

Well volcord I am still referring to the cariant of Anti-Lag system I am used to. Not that i don't believe in your system, the combustion in the xhaust manifold as it makes perfect sense and from the sounds of it you are not talking bull shit. I am simply referring to the system that i know rather than the one you intrduced me to.

The downsides to the anti-lag systems are as follow:

A quick rise of the turbocharger's temperature (which jumps from ~800°C to the 1100°C+ region) whenever the system is activated

A huge stress on the exhaust manifold and pipes (mounted on a street car a bang-bang system would destroy the exhaust system within 50-100 km)

The turbo produces significant boost even at engine idle speeds

The explosions which occur in the exhaust tubes generate important flames which can, sometimes, be seen at the end of the exhaust tube

Reduced engine brake

According to http://www.rallycars.com/Cars/bangbang.html

And this I got from the Misfire System Thread:

CAUTION

This anti-lag system, like all others, causes considerable heating of engine, exhaust valves, exhaust manifold, turbo-charger and exhaust system. Consideration must be given to the possibility of component damage or possible vehicle fire.

Set-up of the anti-lag system MUST NOT be attempted without monitoring EXHAUST GAS TEMPERATURE (EGT) in the vicinity of the turbine wheel. A knowledge of the maximum safe working temperature a of the turbo-charger turbine is essential. A turbo tacho and a pressure gauge to measure the turbo compressor outlet pressure are also useful tools to assist in the setup of anti-lag.

You learn fast young grasshoppa!

I think you covered it there, execept for the point that i am trying to make, without proper cams, the misfires can do hell to your engine, i believe you made a general comment on engines tho, so that's not bad.

Now what we are wondering is about Volvord's version of the anti-lag system. That would do very little to the damage to the engine or trubo on the whole. So i am still how to put this, rather curious about it, i believe Volvord in whole, it's just that i've never heard of or come across a system of that sort . . ever.

Volvord's version is based on delayed ignition timing right?

No, I detailed the sytem I am familiar with earlier in this thread, it was/is a system that has been used for years, many years prior to the sofisicated electronics used today. By simply installing an injector into the exhaust mainfold before the turbocharger and triggering it with an idle control switch, the fuel entering the manifold will ignite, this expanding gas will maintain a resonable turbine speed and reduce or eliminate turbo lag in competition events..

As I mentioned earlier and was later confirmed the electronic delay system has some very high inherant risks. Any time ignition is retarded combusion temperature increase dramatically, risk of detonation is high, and fuel wash to the cylinders and oil dilution occures. With the system I describe combustion temperatures remain inchanged, the fuel burning in the exhaust does not increase turbo temperatures to a critical level. But I should add a couple items: 1) this system will only produce lower static boost levels of 0.1 to 0.3 bar nothing near the 1.0-1.5 bar mentioned with the electronic version. 2) any antilag system must only be used where the driver is on and off the throttle, not in situations where the throttle is realeased for long periods of time.

this might be a stupid question, but oh well, i dont know much about NOS, so my question is, a NOS shot will make your car go about how much faster?

and also this forum has been vary informational,ive learned a lot from this, thank you.

this might be a stupid question, but oh well, i dont know much about NOS, so my question is, a NOS shot will make your car go about how much faster?

and also this forum has been vary informational,ive learned a lot from this, thank you.


one thing we have around here is we hate to call it NOS.....NOS is a brand...we prefer to call it nitrous or N2O

how much faster is hard to say....but nitrous will be preset for a certain shot

a 35 shot will ad 35 Hp a 150 shot will ad 150Hp.....so your car has a certain amout more of hp (depending on the shot) which will make it faster...how much faster it depends on the car and on the shot

if you have a civic si with 160hp and a 50 shot when the nitrous will engage you'll have potentially up to 210hp....so that civic will be as fast as a si with a 210hp engine