a few questions please before i buy
Mille Racer 69
05-05-2008, 03:44 AM
I found a '93 740IL with 190,000 miles, I've never owned a BMW before.
Has a new radiator, new brake solenoid, I drove it, shifts very smoothly, good power, paint is imaculate, interior great too, doesn't look like any electronical malfunctions, he used to work for a certified bmw shop. I drive my work van home everyday, so I don't have to commute in it, I pretty much ride my motorcycle wherever I go whenever possible, so I won't be racking on miles. He said the only thing it needs are new cylinder gaskets, I think I can take care of that myself, just open the top part of the block, take old gaskets out, replace with new.
-for $2,800 does this sound like a good deal?
-I did research on the year and model, it sounds like people either love them or hate them, no middle, why?
-what exactly does the "high maintenance" consist of and how often that everybody warns everyone else of?
-I'm mostly a conservative driver, I like 70-80mph just cruising, does this help life of parts?
-what parts go out often?
-Do they constantly break down or something, numberous people complaining of going out to start it and they get a dead battery?
-is there something I should be weary of or to watch out for???:confused: Don't hold back, let me know
Thanks for your time guys, please answer as many questions as you can.
~Nathan
Has a new radiator, new brake solenoid, I drove it, shifts very smoothly, good power, paint is imaculate, interior great too, doesn't look like any electronical malfunctions, he used to work for a certified bmw shop. I drive my work van home everyday, so I don't have to commute in it, I pretty much ride my motorcycle wherever I go whenever possible, so I won't be racking on miles. He said the only thing it needs are new cylinder gaskets, I think I can take care of that myself, just open the top part of the block, take old gaskets out, replace with new.
-for $2,800 does this sound like a good deal?
-I did research on the year and model, it sounds like people either love them or hate them, no middle, why?
-what exactly does the "high maintenance" consist of and how often that everybody warns everyone else of?
-I'm mostly a conservative driver, I like 70-80mph just cruising, does this help life of parts?
-what parts go out often?
-Do they constantly break down or something, numberous people complaining of going out to start it and they get a dead battery?
-is there something I should be weary of or to watch out for???:confused: Don't hold back, let me know
Thanks for your time guys, please answer as many questions as you can.
~Nathan
lincolnmaster80
05-06-2008, 01:10 PM
I'll try to answer your questions and alay any fears you may have about BMW's. First off, Driving Is Believing. No car rides nicer, drives better, feels more comfortable than a high-end sport luxury mobile like the 7-series BMW.
I found a '93 740IL with 190,000 miles, I've never owned a BMW before.
Has a new radiator, new brake solenoid, I drove it, shifts very smoothly, good power, paint is imaculate, interior great too, doesn't look like any electronical malfunctions, he used to work for a certified bmw shop.
It sounds like it has been taken good care of. Of course, any vehicle you buy, you want to know that it has been looked after. Like any car, a BMW neglected will need more work than one that has had maintenance kept up on. However, in my experience with mechanics, they all seem to think that they know more than any mechanic out there, and feel that they are the only ones doing a proper job. In this case, he works at a Certified BMW Shop (only ones I know like that are the dealers), so he has gone through BMW's mechanic program that they have, so chances are good that he does know what he's doing when it comes to BMW's in general.
He said the only thing it needs are new cylinder gaskets, I think I can take care of that myself, just open the top part of the block, take old gaskets out, replace with new.
It's a little more complicated than that, but that's the 'not so long winded' way of explaining it.
-for $2,800 does this sound like a good deal?
That's a very good deal. I take it you live in the USA? In Canada, that BMW would be selling for the equivalent of $7000-$12,000 USD, depending on condition.
-I did research on the year and model, it sounds like people either love them or hate them, no middle, why?
That's true. People don't seem to understand that BMW's need work and maintenance too. Some seem to believe that because they are BMW's, they are indestructable, they never break down, never need to be service, etc. Well, humans are imperfect, therefore it is impossible for humans to make anything perfect in the absolute sence. So, when a BMW does need work, or breaks down, it's because the owner was stupid enough to think that he owns something great.
Another reason is, people get this notion that BMW's are expensive, of course, it can be provided you take it to the right (or wrong in that case) mechanic who'll charge you an arm, leg, wife, and fourth and fifth grandchild. What they don't understand is the quality of parts will last, sometimes longer than most so-called "cheap and affordable" cars. Parts for our 7's are cheap, if you know where to look. If you are interested, I can post a list of online sites that I regularly get parts from (I'll explain that statement in a moment).
My personal opinion as to why I think people either love them or hate them is that BMW's are so advanced that the technology eludes most people. Technology that was being used even 5 years ago (or a variation of it) is found on my 1990 750iL. So when something goes wrong, they blame the car and not themselves for having the incapacity to understand and inability to be patient with the car.
Personally, I love my 750. I don't think I'd ever go back to anything else.
-what exactly does the "high maintenance" consist of and how often that everybody warns everyone else of?
That really depends what you buy. That said, as I've indicated before, people don't know of the servicing cars in general need. Bushings, ball joints, bearings, grommets, fuses, spark plugs, ignition coils, ignition wires, fuel filters, air filters, engine and tranny oil, etc all need to be changed sooner or later on any car. BMW's are no exception. If you buy a car that hasn't been well looked after, then you'll be spending the next 6 months to a year getting it to a standard where you can say it "rides and drives and operates like the day it came out of the showroom." If you buy one that's been cared for, then you won't be doing those service items as soon.
-I'm mostly a conservative driver, I like 70-80mph just cruising, does this help life of parts?
Definately, your driving style can have an effect on any vehicle you drive. If Johnny Speed Racer was always driving his car at the redline, well, I think you'd agree that would be one car you wouldn't want to buy.
-what parts go out often?
Define often? 20K is often. 60,000 (like O2 sensors)-130,000k (certain suspension bushings) is the typical life span of the most commonly replaced parts. I'm going to reword that question to "what are the most common parts that need replacing?"
In answer, the parts you are looking for, and symptoms of, are upper control arm bushings, tie rods (left, center, and right), all contribute to a violent shimmy at highway speeds. This is also brought on by light braking and doesn't stop until you reach a slower speed. Not hard to replace and not expensive either. I had to do this on my car, and I think everyone who owns or has owned a 7-series has had to do this. They are service items (parts that needed to be replaced eventually, like spark plugs). Upper Strut mounts both front and rear need replacing, strut inserts are the most easiest shock replacement I've ever had to do. Subframe bushings are a real pig to replace, but will last you another 100,000 miles. Seeing as you wont be driving the car often, that's a good 6ish years before you have to start replacing all these parts again.
-Do they constantly break down or something, numberous people complaining of going out to start it and they get a dead battery?
Dead battery...usually because of an electrical power drain with one of the accessories. It's not hard to fix, but it does require a certain ammount of patience to diagnose, and if you hit the right forum, you'll have more help and support than you ever had at your Ford dealer.
But let me ask you this...How many BMW's you see sitting on the side of the road or being towed because "they constatnly break down"?
My point exactly...
-is there something I should be weary of or to watch out for???:confused:
Yes. Take the car for a test drive, not just in the city, but on the highway. Accelerate nice and easy, see how the car responds. Listen and feel for any vibrations, squeeks, etc. Then accelerate hard and fast, listening/feeling for the same thing. Take it on the freeway (or better yet, a straight secluded road) and when safe, brake hard (make sure there is no one behind you when you do this).
Take it on a windy road and drive nice and slow according to the speed limit. Then maybe push it 5 miles over the limit and see how it responds. (Actually, there really is nothing to look for here, I just would like you to see how BMW has made a 5000lbs car handle like no other 5000lbs car...)
Any shaking in the steering wheel when you do these acceleration/braking tests? You know the front end steering and suspension bushings need replacing. Again, not expensive, just time consuming and all possible to do it yourself (DIY).
Any clunks when you reverse gear? The dog bones need replacing. Again, not expensive. Any squeeling or whaling when you reverse? Sticking brake caliper. This can get expensive depending on who makes the brake components but this common on just about any vehicle with caliper/disk brakes.
Look for any lumpyness in the idle, any misfiring. Should run nice and smooth and consistant. On the V12's you should be able to put a cup of coffee on the heat shroud and not have any ripples in the liquid. Some have also balanced a coin and it has not fallen over. You can try this with a V8 as well, I believe, and if the coid doesn't fall over, it's a pretty good indication that the engine is in good running condition.
With all that said, the 7-series are not for the weak-of-heart ownership...BMW left that to Mercedes...:lol: But in my experience, they are no more expensive to own and maintain than your average Ford...it may even be less expensive, but the comfort, quality and ride are beyond compare and IMHO are totally worth the money and effort.
Consider yourself warned.:eek7: :cool:
Now, about my statement when I said "regularly get parts from." When I bought my car, the service items needed to be taken care of. It had a misfire, which new spark plugs, new distributer cap and rotor didn't take care of. The spark plug wires were to blame, and you can find them pretty cheap on eBay for about $100 bucks. Dealer sells them for $1200 for the set, and I opted to get them at Lordco for $600 simply because I didn't trust the eBay sellers quality, although he listed them as original OEM. You will find they are far cheaper for the V8 than they are for the V12. New ignition coils topped it off and the car runs smoother than I have ever seen her run.
The upper control arms needed replacing. I had the classic "Shimmy at 50". Rear dog bones and subframe mounts needed replacing as I had self rear end steer and could not keep the car in a smooth straight line. You will be able to keep in your lane, just not in a smooth line. Wheel bearings were scratching badly and so I replaced those. With 120,000km's on the car, these items were due to be replaced. In the year and a half I have owned it, I have sunk 2500-3000 in parts into my car...that's pretty damn good considering how "expensive" these cars are. I've also done some stereo upgrades, angel eye headlights upgrades, and spent money on some various cleaning products to keep the leather on the seats, door cards, dash, steering wheel, center console...um...and wherever else there's leather, in good shape.
With all that said, I have ordered the last of the parts for my car, rear upper strut mounts, new O2 sensors, and another 7 liters and oil filter for another oil change. And at the rate I drive her, (pretty much on weekends and when I take my girl out for a nice evening) I won't need to replace the parts for anothe 10 years....
I found a '93 740IL with 190,000 miles, I've never owned a BMW before.
Has a new radiator, new brake solenoid, I drove it, shifts very smoothly, good power, paint is imaculate, interior great too, doesn't look like any electronical malfunctions, he used to work for a certified bmw shop.
It sounds like it has been taken good care of. Of course, any vehicle you buy, you want to know that it has been looked after. Like any car, a BMW neglected will need more work than one that has had maintenance kept up on. However, in my experience with mechanics, they all seem to think that they know more than any mechanic out there, and feel that they are the only ones doing a proper job. In this case, he works at a Certified BMW Shop (only ones I know like that are the dealers), so he has gone through BMW's mechanic program that they have, so chances are good that he does know what he's doing when it comes to BMW's in general.
He said the only thing it needs are new cylinder gaskets, I think I can take care of that myself, just open the top part of the block, take old gaskets out, replace with new.
It's a little more complicated than that, but that's the 'not so long winded' way of explaining it.
-for $2,800 does this sound like a good deal?
That's a very good deal. I take it you live in the USA? In Canada, that BMW would be selling for the equivalent of $7000-$12,000 USD, depending on condition.
-I did research on the year and model, it sounds like people either love them or hate them, no middle, why?
That's true. People don't seem to understand that BMW's need work and maintenance too. Some seem to believe that because they are BMW's, they are indestructable, they never break down, never need to be service, etc. Well, humans are imperfect, therefore it is impossible for humans to make anything perfect in the absolute sence. So, when a BMW does need work, or breaks down, it's because the owner was stupid enough to think that he owns something great.
Another reason is, people get this notion that BMW's are expensive, of course, it can be provided you take it to the right (or wrong in that case) mechanic who'll charge you an arm, leg, wife, and fourth and fifth grandchild. What they don't understand is the quality of parts will last, sometimes longer than most so-called "cheap and affordable" cars. Parts for our 7's are cheap, if you know where to look. If you are interested, I can post a list of online sites that I regularly get parts from (I'll explain that statement in a moment).
My personal opinion as to why I think people either love them or hate them is that BMW's are so advanced that the technology eludes most people. Technology that was being used even 5 years ago (or a variation of it) is found on my 1990 750iL. So when something goes wrong, they blame the car and not themselves for having the incapacity to understand and inability to be patient with the car.
Personally, I love my 750. I don't think I'd ever go back to anything else.
-what exactly does the "high maintenance" consist of and how often that everybody warns everyone else of?
That really depends what you buy. That said, as I've indicated before, people don't know of the servicing cars in general need. Bushings, ball joints, bearings, grommets, fuses, spark plugs, ignition coils, ignition wires, fuel filters, air filters, engine and tranny oil, etc all need to be changed sooner or later on any car. BMW's are no exception. If you buy a car that hasn't been well looked after, then you'll be spending the next 6 months to a year getting it to a standard where you can say it "rides and drives and operates like the day it came out of the showroom." If you buy one that's been cared for, then you won't be doing those service items as soon.
-I'm mostly a conservative driver, I like 70-80mph just cruising, does this help life of parts?
Definately, your driving style can have an effect on any vehicle you drive. If Johnny Speed Racer was always driving his car at the redline, well, I think you'd agree that would be one car you wouldn't want to buy.
-what parts go out often?
Define often? 20K is often. 60,000 (like O2 sensors)-130,000k (certain suspension bushings) is the typical life span of the most commonly replaced parts. I'm going to reword that question to "what are the most common parts that need replacing?"
In answer, the parts you are looking for, and symptoms of, are upper control arm bushings, tie rods (left, center, and right), all contribute to a violent shimmy at highway speeds. This is also brought on by light braking and doesn't stop until you reach a slower speed. Not hard to replace and not expensive either. I had to do this on my car, and I think everyone who owns or has owned a 7-series has had to do this. They are service items (parts that needed to be replaced eventually, like spark plugs). Upper Strut mounts both front and rear need replacing, strut inserts are the most easiest shock replacement I've ever had to do. Subframe bushings are a real pig to replace, but will last you another 100,000 miles. Seeing as you wont be driving the car often, that's a good 6ish years before you have to start replacing all these parts again.
-Do they constantly break down or something, numberous people complaining of going out to start it and they get a dead battery?
Dead battery...usually because of an electrical power drain with one of the accessories. It's not hard to fix, but it does require a certain ammount of patience to diagnose, and if you hit the right forum, you'll have more help and support than you ever had at your Ford dealer.
But let me ask you this...How many BMW's you see sitting on the side of the road or being towed because "they constatnly break down"?
My point exactly...
-is there something I should be weary of or to watch out for???:confused:
Yes. Take the car for a test drive, not just in the city, but on the highway. Accelerate nice and easy, see how the car responds. Listen and feel for any vibrations, squeeks, etc. Then accelerate hard and fast, listening/feeling for the same thing. Take it on the freeway (or better yet, a straight secluded road) and when safe, brake hard (make sure there is no one behind you when you do this).
Take it on a windy road and drive nice and slow according to the speed limit. Then maybe push it 5 miles over the limit and see how it responds. (Actually, there really is nothing to look for here, I just would like you to see how BMW has made a 5000lbs car handle like no other 5000lbs car...)
Any shaking in the steering wheel when you do these acceleration/braking tests? You know the front end steering and suspension bushings need replacing. Again, not expensive, just time consuming and all possible to do it yourself (DIY).
Any clunks when you reverse gear? The dog bones need replacing. Again, not expensive. Any squeeling or whaling when you reverse? Sticking brake caliper. This can get expensive depending on who makes the brake components but this common on just about any vehicle with caliper/disk brakes.
Look for any lumpyness in the idle, any misfiring. Should run nice and smooth and consistant. On the V12's you should be able to put a cup of coffee on the heat shroud and not have any ripples in the liquid. Some have also balanced a coin and it has not fallen over. You can try this with a V8 as well, I believe, and if the coid doesn't fall over, it's a pretty good indication that the engine is in good running condition.
With all that said, the 7-series are not for the weak-of-heart ownership...BMW left that to Mercedes...:lol: But in my experience, they are no more expensive to own and maintain than your average Ford...it may even be less expensive, but the comfort, quality and ride are beyond compare and IMHO are totally worth the money and effort.
Consider yourself warned.:eek7: :cool:
Now, about my statement when I said "regularly get parts from." When I bought my car, the service items needed to be taken care of. It had a misfire, which new spark plugs, new distributer cap and rotor didn't take care of. The spark plug wires were to blame, and you can find them pretty cheap on eBay for about $100 bucks. Dealer sells them for $1200 for the set, and I opted to get them at Lordco for $600 simply because I didn't trust the eBay sellers quality, although he listed them as original OEM. You will find they are far cheaper for the V8 than they are for the V12. New ignition coils topped it off and the car runs smoother than I have ever seen her run.
The upper control arms needed replacing. I had the classic "Shimmy at 50". Rear dog bones and subframe mounts needed replacing as I had self rear end steer and could not keep the car in a smooth straight line. You will be able to keep in your lane, just not in a smooth line. Wheel bearings were scratching badly and so I replaced those. With 120,000km's on the car, these items were due to be replaced. In the year and a half I have owned it, I have sunk 2500-3000 in parts into my car...that's pretty damn good considering how "expensive" these cars are. I've also done some stereo upgrades, angel eye headlights upgrades, and spent money on some various cleaning products to keep the leather on the seats, door cards, dash, steering wheel, center console...um...and wherever else there's leather, in good shape.
With all that said, I have ordered the last of the parts for my car, rear upper strut mounts, new O2 sensors, and another 7 liters and oil filter for another oil change. And at the rate I drive her, (pretty much on weekends and when I take my girl out for a nice evening) I won't need to replace the parts for anothe 10 years....
Mille Racer 69
05-07-2008, 01:19 AM
Wow, thank you so much, I really appreciate your detailed response.
that gives me real consolidation when I buy. And yes, I live in California, U.S.
that gives me real consolidation when I buy. And yes, I live in California, U.S.
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